Buyers Beware

We bought into Whispering Rock Resorts a year ago, first time we ever attempted to use it, we consulted the agent we bought the package from, what they might be able to do to help us save money in flying our kids out from Michigan to Phoenix, AZ for last Easter. This agent lives in Phoenix, after giving him the itinery of what we'd like to show the kids, Grand Canyon via the Train out of Williams, AZ - Sedona - Jerome and that area, he proceeded to get the flight tickets at a great savings to us. I drive over the road and my time is very tight, so I trusted this agent to take care of the matter for us. He called (Via cell phones) we told him to go ahead and secure the tickets for us that we would get online as soon as possible and confirm them. In doing so, we discovered that he got tickets leaving Phoenix to Detroit and back to Phoenix again, not Detroit to Phoenix and back to Detroit. We tried and tried to get ahold of those involved to change those tickets to no avail, they were closed for three days following the transaction and we could never get anyone to help us change the tickets. In contacting this agents manager, we had no help there either. What can one do when they don't respond to your messages and when we finally did get a response we were told it would cost US a $100.00 a ticket to change plus the increase of what the tickets were selling for at the time. Remember this is Easter Weekend and the tickets more than doubled. Now a year has pasted and we are still no where near in getting our $1200+ back..we have been fighting with this company a year now to make this right. When did the Grand Canyon move to Detroit???? So beware of dealing with the likes of this company, "Whispering Rock "Resorts"" are not to be trusted.. Has this kind of problem happened to anyone else while dealing with this company??

Ottos4 has several complaints posted reference this resort. However it clearly appears that Otto is just using the forum to complain. Whispering Rocks has attempted to make contact with Otto, but it does not appear that he is interested in resolving same.

A reading of Ottos complaint would indicate that the Resort may not have had any involvement in Ottos claimed transaction. It could have been an employee (out for his own gain), but even that has not been established.

In any case if would appear that Otto, if his complaint is to be believed, made several mistakes in his orginial transaction. Being an Over-the-Road Trucker, he could have stopped at thousands of Travel Agents, while on the road, or he could have called the Airline directly to secure his tickets. It also appears that the wise thing to do after the tickets were secured, would be to spend the extra cash to change the tickets. And, after one year, the tickets may no longer be valid, if unused.

Whispering Rocks does not have a great review on Redweek, but it is only one review. I also question why Otto would think his "agent" would be interested in "saving him money"? In any case, I wonder if Otto has decided to just keep complaining, or if he is really interested in resolving the matter....which might be too late at this point.

I wonder why you would come on here to bad mouth Otto like he is pulling something! Sounds like most agents when you buy through them.

They always tell you if they can be of any help please call! Most don't mean it and sounds like Otto trusted this person enough to try and set family plans to use the resort.

How can a family book airlines to the resort and you book them backwards and don't get it. They live somewhere else and travel to the resort and week later travel away from the resort to their home, this just not that hard to understand!

I don't see anything here that sounds strange. He says he has been calling and getting no where with these people. This looks like their ( passing the buck) one of their people screwed up and instead of helping this family they just want to waste more time on here sounding off and not fixing the problem because now it would cost them money!

Their agent screwed up and the company needs to fix it for him!

I have read nothing here that lets me believe Otto is trying to pull anything !

You say resort has not been able to get a hold of Otto so just send him e-mail with their phone number and cut out the crap of now its to late or we didn't do it and work with this customer. They sure worked with him when selling him a timeshare!

darlene, I didn't get the gist that jons was trying to slam otto.

The manager of the resort in question has written in this forum requesting that otto get in touch with him, saying that he isn't aware of the complaints otto is expressing.

If otto does a search he can find the post from the manager at the resort. The manager seems to be willing to help otto if otto will get in touch with him.

It would be wise for otto to follow up on all his posts concerning his complaints. As jons says, otto doesn't seem to be doing that.

darlenep30 wrote:

I wonder why you would come on here to slam Otto like he is pulling something! Sounds like most agents when you buy through them. They always tell you if they can be of any help please call! Most don't mean it and sounds like Otto trusted this person enough to try and set family plans to use the resort.

How can a family book airlines to the resort and you book them backwards and don't get it. They live somewhere else and travel to the resort and week later travel away from the resort to their home, this just not that hard to understand!

I don't see anything here that sounds strange. He says he has been calling and getting no where with you people. This looks like you or( passing the buck) one of your people screwed up and instead of helping this family you just want to waste more time on here sounding off and not fixing the problem!

Your agent screwed up and your company needs to fix it for him!

I have read nothing here that lets me believe Otto is trying to pull anything !

Just sounds like another timeshare rip off that gives timesharing a bad name.

You say you haven't been able to get a hold of Otto so while sounding off here and making excuses just send him e-mail with your phone number and cut out the crap of now its to late or we didn't do it and work with this customer. You sure worked with him when selling him a timeshare!

Darlene; You need to be familiar with the postings if you intend to respond with your own complaint. I see that as the big problem with forums.

I am no more associated with this resort than you are. I am not slamming Otto, just trying to get him to do his part in resolving this matter, rather than just continuing to complain.

Otto has several diferent posts in Redweek Forums, complaining about this matter (all the same posts). After his orginial complaint was posted, the General Mgr at WR responded, asking Otto to contact him, as he was not aware of the problem. He even left his phone number to Otto.

As I, along with others, were interested in the resolution of this matter, we waited for Ottos response re same. After quite awhile, I contacted the GM regarding the matter and suggested that he post the resolution, since Otto hadn't. He stated he would gladly post same, once Otto called. Otto still has not called him, but continues to complain.

I don't know who is right/wrong in this matter, but when you post a complaint in the Forum and when the Resort shows an interest in discussing/resolving, I think you have a duty to follow-up your post with the the outcome. Fair is Fair.

Based purely on the info provided by Otto in his post, I think he may have made some mistakes, either in handling the orginial problem or in his posted facts. But I don't know, because Otto doesn't show any follow-up.

Its this simple....Otto made a public complaint...the resort said call and we will discuss....Otto hasn't called, but keeps complaining.

So Darlene....I have nothing to do with WR; I don't have any agents; I havn't slammed anyone; and last, I didn't sell him a timeshare. In the meantime, it's been nice talking to you.

jons29 Darlene; You need to be familiar with the postings if you intend to respond with your own complaint. I see that as the big problem with forums. -----------------------------------------------------------------------

My post included you because you come across knowing all these facts of which you state are listed in some past complaints from Otto and as you said you contacted the GM about this matter.

You state Otto was told to call the resort and Gm to handle the problem and I wonder how you know all this if your not involved in this! How do you know if he called or not! I just don't see where this becomes your business or why you would be putting your nose in to Otto and resort company business!

I really don't think the agent or Otto will handle all this on Redweek so us posters can read about it!

If like you say you have nothing to do with this company or agent then you have no right to be involved in the dealings on a personal matter,your just a poster on here like the rest of us.

It just sounds like you are very involved in every part of the issue and to be honest I don't understand why!

It is nice for people to come on here and try and help but when you take it on yourself to contact a GM and give him advice on how to handle a problem just sounds strange to me!

Like I said I don't live on Redweek and don't read every post but have been here for couple years and I don't need to know every issue or read every post to respond to one post.

This is the kind of thing that happens on here with a few of the people that seem to live on this site and tell everyone else what to do and think! This is the reason I spend less time on Redweek the last six months!

How would you feel later to find this Otto is just a hard working family man that was screwed over buy this company/agent because as we all know in these forums how honest these timeshare sales/agents are!

darlene, in defense of jons, nobody posting in these forums lives on Redweek.

I, myself, come here most every morning with my cup of coffee and try to answer any questions that I can relating to timesharing in order to help the less timeshare educated Redweek members.

If regular knowledgeable posters such as jons didn't participate, then the forums at Redweek wouldn't exist or would be rampant with misinformation.

I, nor jons, nor anyone else particiaptes on these forums trying "to tell everyone else what to think" as you have been lead to believe. We post timeshare information from experience and/or education and that information you can choose to use or you can choose to ignore (free will) such as our warning of 'upfront fee resale companies'.

I saw jons as trying to help otto resolve his problem by asking otto to get in touch with the manager of the resort in question as the mananger had posted for otto to please do so and he included his telephone number.

darlenep30 wrote:

This is the kind of thing that happens on here with a few of the people that seem to live on this site and tell everyone else what to do and think! This is the reason I spend less time on Redweek the last six months!

Darlene, To respond to your post in part I will try to explain/answer your comments:

Darlene wrote: You state Otto was told to call the resort and Gm to handle the problem and I wonder how you know all this if your not involved in this! How do you know if he called or not! I just don't see where this becomes your business or why you would be putting your nose in to Otto and resort company business!..........

,,,,,,Otto posted a $1,200 complaint against a Resort. He has that right. However when the Resort responds that they would like to discuss the matter with Otto, as they did here, either Otto or the Resort should post the resolution, so that the rest of us would know the outcome and whether the complaint was valid or not and was the resolution proper.

Darlene wrote: If like you say you have nothing to do with this company or agent then you have no right to be involved in the dealings on a personal matter,your just a poster on here like the rest of us.

......I probably went further than most would, but I feel that both parties deserve a fair call. After the Resort asked Otto to call, and after a lengthy wait for Otto's next post, I called the GM and suggested that he re-post on the matter and provide the resolution. He responded that he would be happy to do so, once Otto called to discuss, but Otto had not called. However he was still complaining.

Darlene wrote: It just sounds like you are very involved in every part of the issue and to be honest I don't understand why!.....

......I got more involved than usual, simply because I feel that everyone is entitled to a fair hearing. After awhile, I began to believe that Otto was more interested in complaining than he was in resolving.

This was a rare case where the Resort responded to a complaint and expressed a willingness to discuss. I do not feel that it is fair to the Resort, or anyone else, to have a complaint or rant posted against them, with no posted resolution, AFTER the Resort has made an effort to handle the matter. Since Otto does/did not appear interested in following up on his complaint, I simply suggested the Resort do so, in order that we know how it was resolved. If you are going to make a public charge against someone, then you have the responsilibilty to make the outcome public.

Darlene wrote: How would you feel later to find this Otto is just a hard working family man that was screwed over buy this company/agent because as we all know in these forums how honest these timeshare sales/agents are!..........

.......That's what I am trying to find out! Did Otto get taken by "someone", was the complaint valid; did Otto have the right party; did Otto make an error in his orginial handling of the matter; was the Resort at fault and if so, could/did they resolve the matter???

While yes, there are some problems in the TS industry, I am not sure that all of the complaints posted are valid. Like other situations, alot of complainers just want to complain. In this case, if Otto was interested in following-up on the problem, he would have called the GM, whether the final resolution was to his liking or not. But there is no resolution....because Otto keeps complaining, but not resolving. In the meantime, readers keep seeing Otto's complaints and Whispering Rocks is left hanging, due to Otto's failure to communicate with them. I do not believe that is fair to the Resort. Otto should post the resolution, or, admit that he was in error, if that's the case. Then we would know the answer to your question.

In my experience, a large percentage of "complainers" are complaining, simply because things "didn't go their way" or because they "mis-understood" the orginial situation, either because they weren't listening or didn't ask enough questions. And not just in the TS world.

In your case, you attempted to attack me because you didn't know the whole story. "nuff said.

ps: I don't live here either. But I do follow certain posts/subjects and I try not to respond to a post, until I have read the entire topic.

ottos4 wrote:

We bought into Whispering Rock Resorts a year ago, first time we ever attempted to use it, we consulted the agent we bought the package from, what they might be able to do to help us save money in flying our kids out from Michigan to Phoenix, AZ for last Easter. This agent lives in Phoenix, after giving him the itinery of what we'd like to show the kids, Grand Canyon via the Train out of Williams, AZ - Sedona - Jerome and that area, he proceeded to get the flight tickets at a great savings to us. I drive over the road and my time is very tight, so I trusted this agent to take care of the matter for us. He called (Via cell phones) we told him to go ahead and secure the tickets for us that we would get online as soon as possible and confirm them. In doing so, we discovered that he got tickets leaving Phoenix to Detroit and back to Phoenix again, not Detroit to Phoenix and back to Detroit. We tried and tried to get ahold of those involved to change those tickets to no avail, they were closed for three days following the transaction and we could never get anyone to help us change the tickets. In contacting this agents manager, we had no help there either. What can one do when they don't respond to your messages and when we finally did get a response we were told it would cost US a $100.00 a ticket to change plus the increase of what the tickets were selling for at the time. Remember this is Easter Weekend and the tickets more than doubled. Now a year has pasted and we are still no where near in getting our $1200+ back..we have been fighting with this company a year now to make this right. When did the Grand Canyon move to Detroit???? So beware of dealing with the likes of this company, "Whispering Rock "Resorts"" are not to be trusted.. Has this kind of problem happened to anyone else while dealing with this company??

Hi Otto,

Please contact Joe Allen who is the Corporate Owner Services Manager for Aristar Resorts at the South Mountain Preserve formerly known as Whispering Rock. His number is 602.889.6400 X6126, email address is jallen@aristarresorts.com.

Thanks, Marty

jons29 Darlene, To respond to your post in part I will try to explain.

In your case, you attempted to attack me because you didn't know the whole story. "nuff said.

I don't live here either. But I do follow certain posts/subjects and

(I try not to respond to a post, until I have read the entire topic.) ======================================== Seems to be a sly little attempt at a insult!

I think saying I was attacking you is a bit strong because I had question why you were so involved in this case if you have nothing to do with it as you stated!

I take your comment toward me as unfair of not responding to a post until I have read entire topic.

I come on here and read a post from someone name Otto and how would I know that this man made earlier post on this subject if I don't spend all my time on reading every post listed!

It seems to be you that throws these little comments out trying to be sly!( Like reading all post before making comment) This is also why I made comment of some that seem to live on here and reply to every post and tell people what to do and think! Its funny too because these people always try and protect each other from other posters when something is said they don't agree with!

I went back and changed some wording on my first post since you state you have nothing to do with Otto's problems and I take you at your word!

You say you went out of your way to help by calling the GM and I have to stick with my feelings that your sticking your nose in someones business by doing this without being asked!

I don't understand why you feel Otto owes you or anyone else on here the right to know everything going on with him the agent. It is his business and the agent/company and if they want to have all this on Redweek then that is their choice and not some poster that read about it!

I think the post from Marty handles everything and is done the right way!

Your comment though that one should read all the post on here about a complaint before replying sounds like the others that live on here and seem know everything. If all the post from Otto were in the same place I would have possibly taken the time to read some of them depending on how many there are.

I do have better things to do in life than back track to read all past post!

I gave information and phone numbers to a lady few months ago that was asking for help and she never came back and told me what happened if anything. It didn't bother me and until now I had not thought about it because it wasn't my business it was hers!

Can we just stop the arguing?

We don't want Redweek forums to become a mecca for contentious and argumentative posts/threads between members like on some other timeshare forum sites. We are all here to provide information, not argue a certain point concerning reader interpretation.

BTW I haven't seen otto here.

Thank you!

This message string is now closed from further postings.

Thank you for your cooperation.

Marty