Manhattan Club Lawsuit

The lastest from NY AG v TMC as of 01/13/21016 https://iapps.courts.state.ny.us/fbem/DocumentDisplayServlet?documentId=mcagxcyqAQZWVsNsa6gVCw==&system=prod What does this mean?

This from a TMC owner who is an attorney and expert in this field.

"The NYAG is making progress in the civil case and probably did not want to risk putting the case on hold in order to pursue the criminal case (which is probably a lot harder to prove). Based on my reading of the case law, it seems likely that if tmc's motion to stay the civil case had gone forward, tmc would have won,meaning no depositions or anything else until the criminal case was concluded. Of course, the AG is not allowed to take depositions in a criminal case as tmc is presumed innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. If tmc had successfully stayed the civil case, then the March motions also would have been placed on ice until the criminal case ended--would really have stalled the progress of the case.

What are you saying? in non lawyer talk please. Thank you.

irenes93 wrote:

The lastest from NY AG v TMC as of 01/13/21016 https://iapps.courts.state.ny.us/fbem/DocumentDisplayServlet?documentId=mcagxcyqAQZWVsNsa6gVCw==&system=prod What does this mean?

This from a TMC owner who is an attorney and expert in this field.

"The NYAG is making progress in the civil case and probably did not want to risk putting the case on hold in order to pursue the criminal case (which is probably a lot harder to prove). Based on my reading of the case law, it seems likely that if tmc's motion to stay the civil case had gone forward, tmc would have won,meaning no depositions or anything else until the criminal case was concluded. Of course, the AG is not allowed to take depositions in a criminal case as tmc is presumed innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. If tmc had successfully stayed the civil case, then the March motions also would have been placed on ice until the criminal case ended--would really have stalled the progress of the case.

It means the case is moving forward and the NY AG is making the right moves.

Guys.. What would you advice me to do with my case of RHC? Appreciated a piece of an advice a lot. Sorry, again off topic.. But if you guys know what to do.

I'm European bought Royal Holiday Club membership at Wyndham in the Bahamas 2009.

I lost over 14.000,00 USD for nothing to get in return.. Its a long story.. There's really nothing I m able to do in Europe..

Am i able to make it a trial.. In States? Wyndham is not any ok here either.. Not any class actions (because the contract states it) either towards RHC. And anyway rhc is actually something it only exists in tax havens. Blah. I tell you guys this because I want people see the fraudulent business.. Its about tax havens.. Trademarks used.. Many company names.. In my case USD as a currency used..

I made a contract with the company named Holiday Clubs ltd. Cayman Island..

The management company exists in two places Cayman Island and Isle of Man.. Except nothing exists for real.. Only some Mexico center to Americans. And those hotels in Caribbean middle hands sell these memberships.. Its the Holiday Club Credit system.

For me RHC means nothing but a huge joke.

Still wish you guys much luck on your case! And you never know where and what account money goes, right?

Btw. Cayman Island and Isle of Man are UK based tax havens! Although the law in the contract also used Arizona! In operating rules Swiss law etc etc..

I did not pay my fees in 2015 and only heard from TMC once regarding this. I normally get billed around Aug when my fees are due in Feb. I have yet to receive billing for this year. Has anyone else not received their invoice for 2016?

I received my maintenance bill in Dec along with several calls, that I did not answer. Just received second statement with late fees and interest added. I am still not paying. I refuse to pay for something I am not getting.

elainef88 wrote:

I did not pay my fees in 2015 and only heard from TMC once regarding this. I normally get billed around Aug when my fees are due in Feb. I have yet to receive billing for this year. Has anyone else not received their invoice for 2016?

I also received my bill twice , & I did not pay initially but when I called to book days for 2016 , they will not let me book for 2016 until I pay my maintenance fees so I just recently paid unfortunately .

I agree with Janice. I refuse to pay maintenance for a timeshare unit which I am routinely denied the use of. I told them to sue me. I'll be happy to surrender title back to TMC!!!!

Bob B

janicef119 I received my maintenance bill in Dec along with several calls, that I did not answer. Just received second statement with late fees and interest added. I am still not paying. I refuse to pay for something I am not getting.

Has anyone tried to book time? I did and had no trouble. I agree fees are high but it's what we agreed to and if we can book time not sure why people would be upset that they need to pay their fee. We have gotten used to the idea with a timeshare you need to plan way in advance if you want your time. They never told us that but we know by past experience and only one time were we unable to book and that was when we called only 3 months in advance. Now we call 9 months to a year ahead of time. By not paying your fee you are hurting the maintenance of the property, and all owners. I'm sure your credit will also be impacted plus you could be held liable for late fees. Not a good idea. This could take years to resolve and may not end up in owners favor. I'm not willing to take that risk. You can always rent it if you don't want to use it and recover most of the maintenance fee. We did that two years successfully.

I did not received a bill in December. I had called in late October or early November to tell them my credit card number had been changed, and that I wanted them to bill me going forward.

Hello. To address some of your points I would like to start out by respectfully stating that I believe many owners are hesitant to pay the maintenance fee because of the unreasonable increasing costs year after year. As far as I know nobody agreed to this and some individuals just can no longer afford this expense.As far as reserving your week in advance, again many owners have tried to do that unsuccessfully. Though they have continued to pay the escalating fees to the Manhattan club without any benefit . With regards to hurting the upkeep of the property that I believe is a non-issue. I do not recall many owners complaining about the appearance of the Manhattan club except for maybe minor issues. Again many owners feel that they have continued to pay their maintenance fee year after year and not have been able to book any time but the Manhattan club has benefited by not only accepting their money but then booking with outside groups or individuals .So in fact there has been funds for the maintenance of the property. Finally, regarding owners credit and renting out their time there are two issues concerning this . Each owners personal situation is different and I am sure everyone is aware of how it might affect their overall credit history.Also there have been many owners that have tried to rent out their time at the Manhattan club but have been unsuccessful but again still continue to pay these exorbitant fees. This is my own opinion on the situation. Obviously I can not speak for others but I certainly can understand owners that have hesitated on continuing to pay these fees. Thank you.

cookiel7 wrote:

Has anyone tried to book time? I did and had no trouble. I agree fees are high but it's what we agreed to and if we can book time not sure why people would be upset that they need to pay their fee. We have gotten used to the idea with a timeshare you need to plan way in advance if you want your time. They never told us that but we know by past experience and only one time were we unable to book and that was when we called only 3 months in advance. Now we call 9 months to a year ahead of time. By not paying your fee you are hurting the maintenance of the property, and all owners. I'm sure your credit will also be impacted plus you could be held liable for late fees. Not a good idea. This could take years to resolve and may not end up in owners favor. I'm not willing to take that risk. You can always rent it if you don't want to use it and recover most of the maintenance fee. We did that two years successfully.

I was able. a while back, to recoup my maintenance fees by renting it out. (2) I can no longer do that. No one will pay the exorbitant fees. There is no longer any benefit to this ownership, just a burden. Usually, a timeshare developer will turn over the project to the owners, when he has sold out. This developer has continued to buy units from the hotel next door to develop. After 20 years he still treats it as his own little pot of gold. Owners are not even represented on the Board except for the hand picked ones that he has chosen. He has written in his own management company to be there forever. In California a majority corporate owner must look out for the minority owners under corporate law. He not only does not do this, he ignores them altogether. He needs to be out of there completely. TMC owners have been his ticket to a very lucrative business for him.

Has there been yet another postponement for the justice hearing? Is all this not damage to the owners? I continue to pay these fees and use it, though I have given up trying to get the split weeks I am entitled to in my contract. I bought this property specifically to break up the trips abroad that we might make. It seems that TMC prefers you take full weeks, which is not in the contract! This is already a breach of contract for me, as far as I'm concerned. I'm a California resident and I've been told I have to hire a NY attorney. We are in our eighties now and just can't afford this nightmare!

I agree, we are lucky that we purchased a set 3 nights and automatically get those every year and have just tacked on the days prior. We have not try to split our other 4 days so that might be an issue. I also agree our contract does allow for that and certainly should be able to do that. The maintanance fees are outrageous. We live in a luxury building in the Washington DC area and don't pay anywhere close to that for a full month. Our building offers much more than the MC with the exception of daily cleaning service. We are paying over $8000 a month for maintenance as a group. Insane...We are hoping AG of New York will be successful in at a minimum getting our fees reduced and forcing the owner to reimburse us for some amount. I don't believe it's a good idea just not to pay.

laurah136 wrote:

I was able. a while back, to recoup my maintenance fees by renting it out. (2) I can no longer do that. No one will pay the exorbitant fees. There is no longer any benefit to this ownership, just a burden. Usually, a timeshare developer will turn over the project to the owners, when he has sold out. This developer has continued to buy units from the hotel next door to develop. After 20 years he still treats it as his own little pot of gold. Owners are not even represented on the Board except for the hand picked ones that he has chosen. He has written in his own management company to be there forever. In California a majority corporate owner must look out for the minority owners under corporate law. He not only does not do this, he ignores them altogether. He needs to be out of there completely. TMC owners have been his ticket to a very lucrative business for him.

Has there been yet another postponement for the justice hearing? Is all this not damage to the owners? I continue to pay these fees and use it, though I have given up trying to get the split weeks I am entitled to in my contract. I bought this property specifically to break up the trips abroad that we might make. It seems that TMC prefers you take full weeks, which is not in the contract! This is already a breach of contract for me, as far as I'm concerned. I'm a California resident and I've been told I have to hire a NY attorney. We are in our eighties now and just can't afford this nightmare!

the maintenance fees are outrageously high and not in line with what other similar timeshares are charging.............over 300% increase since the initial purchase...................it's ludicrous to be happy with people who are still, in effect, stealing from you.

cookiel7 wrote:

Has anyone tried to book time? I did and had no trouble. I agree fees are high but it's what we agreed to and if we can book time not sure why people would be upset that they need to pay their fee. We have gotten used to the idea with a timeshare you need to plan way in advance if you want your time. They never told us that but we know by past experience and only one time were we unable to book and that was when we called only 3 months in advance. Now we call 9 months to a year ahead of time. By not paying your fee you are hurting the maintenance of the property, and all owners. I'm sure your credit will also be impacted plus you could be held liable for late fees. Not a good idea. This could take years to resolve and may not end up in owners favor. I'm not willing to take that risk. You can always rent it if you don't want to use it and recover most of the maintenance fee. We did that two years successfully.

AGREED...................NO QUESTION. THE FEES ARE USURIOUS AND AT LEAST 300% MORE THAN THEY WERE AT THE INITIAL PURCHASES.

MANAGEMENT IS LITERALLY STEALING FROM US.

kevin631 wrote:

Hello. To address some of your points I would like to start out by respectfully stating that I believe many owners are hesitant to pay the maintenance fee because of the unreasonable increasing costs year after year. As far as I know nobody agreed to this and some individuals just can no longer afford this expense.As far as reserving your week in advance, again many owners have tried to do that unsuccessfully. Though they have continued to pay the escalating fees to the Manhattan club without any benefit . With regards to hurting the upkeep of the property that I believe is a non-issue. I do not recall many owners complaining about the appearance of the Manhattan club except for maybe minor issues. Again many owners feel that they have continued to pay their maintenance fee year after year and not have been able to book any time but the Manhattan club has benefited by not only accepting their money but then booking with outside groups or individuals .So in fact there has been funds for the maintenance of the property. Finally, regarding owners credit and renting out their time there are two issues concerning this . Each owners personal situation is different and I am sure everyone is aware of how it might affect their overall credit history.Also there have been many owners that have tried to rent out their time at the Manhattan club but have been unsuccessful but again still continue to pay these exorbitant fees. This is my own opinion on the situation. Obviously I can not speak for others but I certainly can understand owners that have hesitated on continuing to pay these fees. Thank you.

cookiel7 wrote:

Has anyone tried to book time? I did and had no trouble. I agree fees are high but it's what we agreed to and if we can book time not sure why people would be upset that they need to pay their fee. We have gotten used to the idea with a timeshare you need to plan way in advance if you want your time. They never told us that but we know by past experience and only one time were we unable to book and that was when we called only 3 months in advance. Now we call 9 months to a year ahead of time. By not paying your fee you are hurting the maintenance of the property, and all owners. I'm sure your credit will also be impacted plus you could be held liable for late fees. Not a good idea. This could take years to resolve and may not end up in owners favor. I'm not willing to take that risk. You can always rent it if you don't want to use it and recover most of the maintenance fee. We did that two years successfully.

Despite a public blackout on information, Eichner's attorneys continue to make noise in court, where they have successfully blocked the AG from proceeding with four under-oath depositions of key figures in the Manhattan Club case, including the former head of sales. The club's legal team filed motions for a "show cause" hearing Dec. 9 and secured a temporary restraining order to halt the AG's examinations pending a hearing that was scheduled for Jan. 26. One week ago, however, the petition for a hearing was withdrawn after the AG, voluntarily, withdrew subpoenas for the potential witnesses. Eichner's team then asked the court to vacate the TRO "without prejudice," which means they can re-file it at a later date if desired. Legal buffs will enjoy the rationale that Eichner's attorneys presented to justify blocking the subpoenas: they asserted that, since the AG is pursuing simultaneous civil and criminal investigations, the AG would use answers from the civil depositions to further its criminal case. Without protection, the attorneys argued, Eichner's colleagues would have to invoke their 5th Amendment protection against self-incrimination --- which, they said, the AG would use against them (as if they were admissions of wrongdoing) in the civil investigation of fraud at the club. None of this does a single thing for owners worried about reservations or maintenance fees. It's just another twist in a tortured legal case that will continue to haunt the timeshare industry until it is resolved on behalf of Manhattan Club owners. Eichner's lead attorney in this round of legal jousting is Kelly A. Librera. Serwat Farooq is the AG's primary lawyer, among many. I encourage all owners to read the NY court files, which are easily accessible over the Internet: case 451536-2014 in the Supreme Court of New York, New York County.

How did you rent it out and how much did it cost you? I tried listing it for rental on a site with no go.

cookiel7 wrote:

I'm not willing to take that risk. You can always rent it if you don't want to use it and recover most of the maintenance fee. We did that two years successfully.

There was scheduled a hearing on Friday January 15, 2016, at the Supreme Court of New York, case #451536/2014. Case title is Schneiderman v. Eichner. Who knows the results.

jeff_reports wrote:

Despite a public blackout on information, Eichner's attorneys continue to make noise in court, where they have successfully blocked the AG from proceeding with four under-oath depositions of key figures in the Manhattan Club case, including the former head of sales. The club's legal team filed motions for a "show cause" hearing Dec. 9 and secured a temporary restraining order to halt the AG's examinations pending a hearing that was scheduled for Jan. 26. One week ago, however, the petition for a hearing was withdrawn after the AG, voluntarily, withdrew subpoenas for the potential witnesses. Eichner's team then asked the court to vacate the TRO "without prejudice," which means they can re-file it at a later date if desired. Legal buffs will enjoy the rationale that Eichner's attorneys presented to justify blocking the subpoenas: they asserted that, since the AG is pursuing simultaneous civil and criminal investigations, the AG would use answers from the civil depositions to further its criminal case. Without protection, the attorneys argued, Eichner's colleagues would have to invoke their 5th Amendment protection against self-incrimination --- which, they said, the AG would use against them (as if they were admissions of wrongdoing) in the civil investigation of fraud at the club. None of this does a single thing for owners worried about reservations or maintenance fees. It's just another twist in a tortured legal case that will continue to haunt the timeshare industry until it is resolved on behalf of Manhattan Club owners. Eichner's lead attorney in this round of legal jousting is Kelly A. Librera. Serwat Farooq is the AG's primary lawyer, among many. I encourage all owners to read the NY court files, which are easily accessible over the Internet: case 451536-2014 in the Supreme Court of New York, New York County.

As a member of Holiday Systems I was able to rent the units out a few years ago. I tried again last year and could see I was not going to have any takers so withdrew it and placed it in RCI. Since they deal in points I have so far only used a portion of those points to book two weeks in Italy this year. I have had two parties inquire about renting but they feel the rental amount I want to recoup is too high. As do I! Renting seems to be no longer an option.

We rented it out on Red Week. I believe the posting cost $35. We just looked at what folks were renting their units for the same week and lowered ours slightly from the others and it rented within 2 weeks. I would suggest not putting it on the site more then 2 months before so you have the option of staying in it your self and you also have the ability to rent some of the days of the week to different individuals if you need too or want to use a couple yourself. It's worked for us but we also have the week after Christmas through after New Years, which is a desirable time to be in NYC...I also saw that some folks rented on Craig's list but we have never tried their site. We require a certified check be sent to us overnight before removing from availability site.