Timeshare Points vs. Weeks

charlest66 wrote:

Sunterra Sun Options have more value and are much more flexible. A week at a Sunterra Resort in prime time any time full week is only 5,500 - 6,000 points. You get your exchange more readily with II (not through RCI - we always had bad luck with RCI and switched to II - they are more quality Resorts. No exchange fee through Sunterra and your free II Membership gives you the same choice to swap a week or a few days at a minimal amount of points. You always have too many points to use. It is the greatest way to go economically more sound for your money to stay in First Class Resorts$ You pay for what you get!

AGREED! Sunterra is now Diamond Resorts International with 120 resorts in their network of "The club" w/ NO exchange fees within the Club sytem. That was a huge value to us! We can stay at any of the 120 resorts around the world and they have the most gorgeous properties in Europe! The Club membership is only available through the developer and we purchased 10,000 pts and can get 3 weeks out of that amount of points. We can book short notice of 59 days or less and pay HALF the point values for any given resort within the system if its available. Studios' are almost always available and in Diamond Resorts the studios are equivalent to a luxury suite in a Hilton or Hyatt or Westin. We trade within Interval International and ALL of cream of the crop resorts are there. Westin's, Four Seasons, Hyatt, WorldMark, Disney and more... I personally loved Westin and Four Seasons, but did not want to pay that huge intial cost for those properties and and their maintenance fees, and did not want a fixed week! but now I can stay there anyway!! just pay the $139 fee when I want to stay there! I also loved Hyatt, but did not want their price tag for a peak season 2bdrm for two weeks at $54K! but with our Sunterra/Diamond points package! We took a Vacation at the Hyatt Highlands in Carmel exhanged through I.I. and the rack rates for the rooms were $785/night! We also stayed at the Hyatt in Tahoe also, it was fabulous! we stayed in a huge luxurious 1bdrm for 6500 pts and had 3500 points left over which will give us two weeks in a studio anywhere in the Diamond system if booked 59 days or less! often we are short notice travelers anyway and have found it fabulous and fun to find a few places we want to go and see what is available, book at half the point values and zip off to a 5 star $500-1200/ night resort for a week for 1650 points! I cannot say enough great things about it!! I personally like the ease and flexibility of the points! I have a friend who also purchase/upgraded her old RCI gold crown resort at Diamond with a 'Club Select" that turns their fixed weeks in to points in the Diamond system and be rewarded back with 6000-8000 pts if their week is a Gold Crown resort! My friend did this with her fixed week with her older time share she purchased 10 yrs ago, and got 7000 pts back with a point package purchase of only 5000 pts. She actually got MORE value back in points than she originally paid for that product 10 yrs ago! it was fabulous, she flipped! She now has 12,000 pts, so she can take a trip to Europe in France which she was not able to get with her older product in an RCI exchange. Now she is planning a 3 week trip through Europe and she is using all the Diamond resorts to stay at and is thrilled to have no exchange fees, AND she is able to go this year! The xchange fees are not a huge amount, but she felt it "nickled and dimed" her too much! She said that alone saved her $600 on that one trip! Love it!! she also was upgraded into Interval International which she felt had better selection of a much better quality of resorts and no banking and hoping to go! Just book and go! We both agree that points and Sunterra/Diamond and I.I.is the way to go in the 21st century! the GPS of Vacation Ownership!

divad2 wrote: ...basically a long "hooray for Sunterra / Diamond".... ==================================================

I am happy for your enthusiasm about what you own (or maybe, are just subtly advertising for free). In either case, with all due respect, there is no need or benefit to posting this lengthy endorsement (ad?) of your Sunterra / Diamond product THREE separate times in two separate Redweek forums (as you have done).

ken1193

divad2 wrote:

wrote: ...basically a long "hooray for Sunterra / Diamond".... ==================================================

I am happy for your enthusiasm about what you own (or maybe, are just subtly advertising for free). In either case, with all due respect, there is no need or benefit to posting this lengthy endorsement (ad?) of your Sunterra / Diamond product THREE separate times in two separate Redweek forums (as you have done).

mike1536 wrote:

That's one thing I don't understand about the RCI point system .... some RCI related resorts aren't on the point system and are still only on the weeks system. How come all RCI related resorts aren't on the RCI point system? ====== We own in two large point system resort groups within which we can merrily exchange at no extra cost. I am hoping their resorts never get scooped up into the RCI Points system!

RCI Points would be useful if we owned at a single resort or any group with limited internal exchange privileges (like Westgate etc.) but we don't need or want lots of external exchanges. So far, at least, RCI Weeks has been quite adequate for most purposes and Fairfield/ Wyndham's access to RCI Nightly Stays has solved the occasional need for shorter stays (at lower fees). MD

BY THE WAY, WHAT TIME ZONE IS THIS SITE ON? WEST COAST? I JUST FINISHED TYPING THE ABOVE. IT IS 5:43 HERE!

adahiscout wrote:

mike1536 wrote:

That's one thing I don't understand about the RCI point system .... some RCI related resorts aren't on the point system and are still only on the weeks system. How come all RCI related resorts aren't on the RCI point system? ====== We own in two large point system resort groups within which we can merrily exchange at no extra cost. I am hoping their resorts never get scooped up into the RCI Points system!

RCI Points would be useful if we owned at a single resort or any group with limited internal exchange privileges (like Westgate etc.) but we don't need or want lots of external exchanges. So far, at least, RCI Weeks has been quite adequate for most purposes and Fairfield/ Wyndham's access to RCI Nightly Stays has solved the occasional need for shorter stays (at lower fees). MD

BY THE WAY, WHAT TIME ZONE IS THIS SITE ON? WEST COAST? I JUST FINISHED TYPING THE ABOVE. IT IS 5:43 HERE!

Yes, we are on Pacific time.

How does the points system take into account inflation or increase in value of the timeshare you own? If I buy a 3 bdr unit today and my resort is still building 3 bdr units 3 yrs later is there the chance of a difference in point values?

Even if my unit isn't worth as much as a brand new unit, what happens after my unit is updated say 10 years later, do I get more points?

Thank you for any information. I am having a hard time deciding HOW I should go about converting my week into the point system. I understand and appreciate the benefits but I am being told by the Wyndham rep at the property we are enjoying thatit will cost me $17,000 to be a VIP owner. The Wyndham property I own is valued at 154,000 points but I am not currently in the points system. By buying a deed back from them I will qualify for VIP. I am being told that I can only convert because I never was offered the opportunity to convert before. I bought the week in 2006 and just learned of the point system while staying at one of their other properties.

Question, can I buy a resale and somehow convert my current week into the point system? How do I best move into the point system? Any other info is appreciated. Tom from Florida

First of all, the VIP benefits do not justify the additional cost (10 fold) to buy from the developer (IMHO). You are better off buying Wyndham points for 1 - 2 cents per point, from the resale market, rather than pay 16 to 17 cents per point from the developer. However, to count towards VIP status, points must be bought from the developer, VIP status is not given to resale points. As I said though, the VIP benefits are not worth the extra cost.

Second, you should consider your own situation before rushing off and converting your fixed week to points. If you travel regularrly to the same resort, on the same week each year, keep the wek. But, if you like to visit different places, at different times of the year, then points are the way to go.

This can be true. When I used to own points I had 42,000 annual points at my home resort and could get a 1BR Gold Crown in Southern California for 30,500, then a year later RCI changed the point values for S. Cal. to 46,000 for a 1BR Gold Crown and I no longer could get there in a year without borrowing points. Another thing to watch out for with RCI Points is the fees that RCI keeps increasing for nightly stays and then if you stay less than 7 nights the resort you stay at may charge you a housekeeping fee which can range anywhere from $25.00 (I paid $65 for a 2BR for 3 nights) and up depending on where you stay -- call the resort before booking and ask them how much or if they charge housekeeping fees for stays less than 7 nights.

I prefer the points. They are so much more flexible than weeks. We own with Diamond Resorts International, previously Sunterra. If I have a week, I can only use it for a week, or if it is a 2 bedroom lockout, 2 weeks if I divide it up. That's it. With points, we have 53,000, we can go away for 3 day weekends close to home. We usually go to Sedona, AZ 3 or 4 times a year, as well as away for a week or 2. Depending on where I go for a week, I can get 4 weeks in Hawaii, 10 weeks in Willamsburg, VA, or any combination which adds up to 53,000 points. I can also use my points for cruises, airline tickets, maintenence fees, and now they have added airline points, a full day at a luxury spa, race car driving, etc. Points work for us a lot better than weeks.

I own both a points timeshare through II as we own a Marriott, and we also own a week through Diamond Resorts, which right now is traded through RCI. A rep came and discussed turning our "weeks" through RCI timeshare (Kaanapali Beach Club) into points with II for $3000 (ouch). I'm leaning toward wanting to trade our week to what seems to be the greater flexibility of points with II, but don't want to pay $3000 to do so. If we already own one property with II, is it possible to convert our second one to II as well to the points system, or do we have to pay that (outrageous) fee? I'm a little confused with what's being discussed because both points and weeks are available through RCI, but apparenty II only has points?

Anyone able to shed some light on this? TIA.

cali_girl_xoxo wrote:

I own both a points timeshare through II as we own a Marriott, and we also own a week through Diamond Resorts, which right now is traded through RCI. A rep came and discussed turning our "weeks" through RCI timeshare (Kaanapali Beach Club) into points with II for $3000 (ouch).

I think you mean converting your Kaanapali Beach Club from weeks to RCI Points not II

cali_girl_xoxo wrote:

I'm leaning toward wanting to trade our week to what seems to be the greater flexibility of points with II, but don't want to pay $3000 to do so.

If we already own one property with II, is it possible to convert our second one to II as well to the points system, or do we have to pay that (outrageous) fee? I'm a little confused with what's being discussed because both points and weeks are available through RCI, but apparenty II only has points?

The last I knew, II does not use a Points system. Certain resort systems such as Diamond and DVC uses points to trade within their system, and an owner can also trade with II (Diamond would deposit a week into the system on behalf of the owner). Does Marriott operate the same way for trades with II? If II went to a Points system like RCI Points, it is news to me?

If Kaanapali Beach Club has an agreement with II, then you can use II for trading (I own a resort that trades with both II and RCI). But again, I don't think II went to a Points system in it's entirety.

According to the guy I talked to last night, it is NOT RCI that will be dealing with our Kaanapali Beach Resort if we convert to points, it is II. For the sum of $3000 they'll convert us from RCI to II, and yes, you're right, it is Diamond who then has everything in a points system. Apparently, if I got this right, Diamond has some sort of proprietary system in association with II-- so you go to Diamond's website, which pulls up their linked-in system with II, and they have points attached to each property. You make your choices using the points allotted to you with your timeshare and decide what property to visit utilizing your points. Supposedly you still have the opportunity to go to your home resort each year if you wish. Also, if you go to another timeshare in a 59-day window, then the resorts "cost" half as many points.

From what we were told, the idea is to generate more availability by having each timeshare deposited automatically in the system in the last part of the year, and you choose where you want to go from what will supposedly be a larger pool of available timeshares. The reasoning was that something like 1/3 of the timeshares in II went un-used last year because people didn't deposit them, or they got deposited late in the year and went unused because of that.

That's my understanding, but heaven knows I may be off on this because ... well yeah the guys lips were moving *vbg*

cali_girl_xoxo wrote:

According to the guy I talked to last night, it is NOT RCI that will be dealing with our Kaanapali Beach Resort if we convert to points, it is II. For the sum of $3000 they'll convert us from RCI to II, and yes, you're right, it is Diamond who then has everything in a points system. Apparently, if I got this right, Diamond has some sort of proprietary system in association with II-- so you go to Diamond's website, which pulls up their linked-in system with II, and they have points attached to each property. You make your choices using the points allotted to you with your timeshare and decide what property to visit utilizing your points. Supposedly you still have the opportunity to go to your home resort each year if you wish. Also, if you go to another timeshare in a 59-day window, then the resorts "cost" half as many points.

From what we were told, the idea is to generate more availability by having each timeshare deposited automatically in the system in the last part of the year, and you choose where you want to go from what will supposedly be a larger pool of available timeshares. The reasoning was that something like 1/3 of the timeshares in II went un-used last year because people didn't deposit them, or they got deposited late in the year and went unused because of that.

That's my understanding, but heaven knows I may be off on this because ... well yeah the guys lips were moving *vbg*

It makes more sense now. Diamond does have an agreement with II. Before you convert you may want to do a bit more research. Here's a link to some Diamond Complaints on RedWeek especially with rising MFs and lack of trade availability.

There is also thread on TUG that discusses a member not getting the unit view he originally purchased and how it may have related to him converting to Diamond. Here's the link. You may want to pose your question there as well.

Can you still trade with RCI if you don't switch to Points (i.e join the Diamond system)? Will your MF go up if you join the Diamond Pts system? If you join the DIamond Points, will you still have priority to book at your home resort?

Thanks for the links! It's so confusing, I really need to research this. Supposedly we have the remainder of the week to make up our minds if we want to give.. uhm... pay $3000 for switching to points.

Right now we can trade reasonably well, but we own a Maui property, so perhaps that's why so far its gone well. It's disheartening to see the problems people are having with RCI though so that is one thing that is making points through DRI/II also attractive. So, I'm going to educate myself and try to get those questions you asked answered, and I will weigh back in later. I really appreciate your help.

If you are on the Board of a resort contemplating going to points or are already in points but have a number of units in default on fees will you please consider the following. For three months let all existing weeks holders convert to points for a flat fee (suggest $250 - $500). Half of the proceeds would go to the management association and half would go to the processing broker. Having existing holders paying $2K - $5K to convert is crazy. You are supplying the "sales leads" and you are the ones that will be facing declining maintence revenue streams as an increasing number of units become less attractive. I own in two resorts that have become points members and I am already a points member through other holdings and I am sure I am not alone. Lets get those existing owners that want to get into Points have the opportunity to do so at reasonable rates. After 3 months you can turn it over to sales teams of varying degrees of knowledge. There is a recession on & you should be trying to give current owners (who voted you in) the most alternatives at the best price. Let's all get in the real world. Many peope feel the flexibility of the points program is a major plus. Let's get them in the program at a reasonable price. Thank you

Am I correct in assuming that you would not be just "buying into VIP"? You would be buying additional points and , therefore, additional vacation time. It is too bad that your resale purchase was an old pre-points property. Even though resale purchases can not be used toward VIP, it certainly IS possible to buy Wyndham points-based contracts through resale to get more flexible usage.

MD

I personally would never invest any more of my hard earned money to purchase points. 22 years ago we bought a red week at Orange Lake Country Club when it was a baby.....now the resort is absolutely magnificent. We know that we plan a one week vacation every year, so we either stay our week, exchange at OLCC, or exchange for anywhere we want. I've exchanged prime holiday weeks without any hassle. I've upgraded from my 2BR to a 3BR without a problem. If I want to get away for a long w/e or another week, RCI has always been great at finding a place for a very affordable price. So, if I need so spend $500.00 for any extra week a year, I can do that for 26 years and still only spend $13,000.00. If I want to extend my week, I may need to move to another unit, but in the long run, the money is in my investment account, earning interest and I can spend it the way I want. I am a commited Timeshare Week person.

We listed our unit with Redweek a couple of years and were very happy with the exchanges we made. Then we got snookered into changing our unit to points with the understanding that we gained more benefits through our home unit (Festiva) because we could trade up to newer resorts through Festiva or bank with II and trade through them etc. No one said that the points required to exchange would go up but the points we got would not. Is this a common thing and are we doomed to have to purchase more points every time they inflate their units or builld a new resort? Does this make sense and are there any legal remedies to this mass slaughter? Dick

Actually, this is not unreasonable. They are not allowed to increase the points required at resorts (or buildings) which existed when you bought, but new construction may very well cost more and therefore justify more points for the same time period. Of course, if you only had enough points for one week in high time (or whatever) originally, you might have to settle for 5 or 6 days in a pricier resort, or continue to go to the older ones. The new ones tend to offer more amenities as well as higher construction costs. Guests no longer want a 13" TV. They want flat screen and Wifi. And virtual water parks instead of a simple pool. I suppose you can still reserve a unit like your old one at the same resort and trade it as you have before, but if you go to another resort in your own group with your points, you see new places and save on exchange fees.

We bought our 4 bedroom house many years ago. We could sell today for 5 or 6 times what we paid--but still not have enough to purchase a new 2 bedroom condo! I find this frustrating but not illegal. MD