I am a former TIMESHARE EMPLOYEE IN MEXICO

cindyb636 wrote:

I'm wondering if you've heard from Livingston Property Services in Puerto Vallarta Mexico and if they are legit?

My parents I believe are misled' and trying to help them before they send anymore money.

Why did your parents send LPS money in the first place? What did LPS promise to do for them?

Likely LPS is going to keep pestering your parents for more money saying that it needs money to do this and that for them. Tell your parents firmly to stop any further contact with this company.

By the way, what are your parents hoping to accomplish using such a company? There are probably other ways to do so without using a scam company.

I bet its raintree vacation club!

Very Nice..Thank you so much for providing us such useful information.

Also just signed up with same company any other information you can provide. Should I try and cancel out.

josephh336 wrote:

Also just signed up with same company any other information you can provide. Should I try and cancel out.

Which "same company" are you referring to? Actually, it doesn't really even matter. If you send (or have sent) money to ANY Mexico-based company, you can just kiss that money goodbye --- forever. You can GET "canceled" (by not paying anything further) but you certainly won't get your money back under any imaginable circumstances.

Mexican resale timeshares are a dime a dozen, many (most?) essentially worthless in the resale market. Lots of people are usually looking to unload them for peanuts (or for free). Some will PAY you money to take over their contract. There are many different useless, upfront fee scammer entities which have created a "business" designed to prey upon those Gringos who have ALREADY demonstrated a willingness to part with their money (after all, they already bought into a Mexican RTU contract at least once). These parasites are just a second tier "cottage industry" looking to target that very specific "customer base" and extract even MORE Gringo dollars from them.

Forewarned is forearmed.

If Livingston Property Services says that we have to pay them a $3000.00 'activation fee' in order for them to give us our money for 2 timeshares we sold when we purchased in January of 2017 at the Grand Miramar...is that legit?

Is Mancini Management a legit Company as well?

In a nutshell...Here is the last email we got from them...Livingston Property Services

I’m assuming your Lawyer was no knowledge of Mexican Law. By Law we can’t use the money of your proceeds to pay for our services, taxes or anything by us using that money that is already consider on your name it would be consider fraud unless we had access or signature authorized by you in the bank for that you would have to fly down to approve it.

Money is already in your name as soon as you send us the confirmation of the money to one of our 2 financial Administration companies we can release the funds and same day you will have a tracking number.

If you don’t feel ok with the way we do business I will need a written letter with both names and signatures so we can put your account null and void and we can return the money to the buyer, however you are obligated as it states on our contract to pay the activation it doesn’t mention that comes out of the proceeds.

You have receive a $4,936 USD as an advance payment on the Carriage Ridge Points and $$1,820USD for the Lifestyle Vacation Club for a total advance payment of $6,756 USD so if you decide not to go through as signed on your contract we have grounds to collect that money given for the sale of both properties.

Let us know how would you like to proceed.

Any thoughts?

jodyd60 wrote:

Any thoughts?

Since you've asked for thoughts, here are some of mine:

There is absolutely NOTHING "legit" about ANY of what you have described above, for more reasons than I even care to type, but certainly including the following:

1. There is no such thing as an "activation fee" (although that's the first time I've seen that particular innovative term used). Usually weasels like these call their ransom demand a "transfer tax" or "escrow fee" --- all being equally bogus, non-existent creations.

2. There is no buyer of your "trade ins" and there is no money "earmarked" for you, awaiting dispersal after you pony up a few thousand dollars. That's just pure, unadulterated bull****.

3. No entity in PV Mexico has any collection leverage here; any "collection" threat is empty, bogus and laughable. Mexican law? Really? Just what exactly would THAT be? Whatever it is, if it exists at all it means absolutely NOTHING here in the U.S.

4. Sellers RECEIVE money. Sellers don't PAY money. Repeat this to yourself as many times as necessary to absorb it.

5. The two timeshares you think you "sold" were not "sold" at all, but (allegedly) "traded in". The fact of the matter is that both supposedly "traded in" timeshares are likely still in your name anyhow and, to your future surprise and disappointment, you will likely receive maintenance fee bills for BOTH later this year when maintenance fee bills get issued, just as if your "trade ins" never happened (since in truth, they likely weren't ever lawfully transferred AT ALL).

6. The semi-literate and grammatically deficient quotes you cite from these parasites do not exactly reflect professionalism or inspire any confidence in their credibility.

7. "Trade in" scams are quite common in Mexico. It's all smoke and mirrors. Essentially, they gave you NOTHING for the timeshares you "sold". They merely applied phony "trade in" numbers to an equally inflated purchase price for whatever it is that you bought into. You went for it. Now they want even MORE money from you, as you have previously demonstrated a willingness to "pony up".

The bottom line is that if you send any money TO Mexico, you can just color it GONE --- and rest assured there is NO money coming to you FROM Mexico under ANY imaginable circumstances. it's your decision to make, but forewarned is forearmed.

.

Sounds like a scam to me .

They are all scams. The only way to defeat scams is to stop being stupid.

Hello,

In very simple words - I got scammed by Krystal Resorts, Cancun, into buying their 25 weeks rental program. Not only have I paid a large amount upfront, but have been paying off the balance in monthly installment.

Only recently I realized this was a scam and have since found this web site and a whole thread devoted to Krystal Resort's cam.

I realize that I have absolutely no chance of recourse - but with three more years of installment payments left, what would happen if I suddenly stop making those payments? The US company that is collecting the payments for Krystal is Concord in AZ, which is a collections agency.

Will they be legally able to enforce the contract and destroy my credit? Any advise on how I can get out of this mess?

Thanks!

If you care about your credit score than I suggest you pay for the contract that you agreed to. Remember that rental is not easy otherwise everyone would do it. There is money to be made from renting those Krystal weeks, just got to have knowledge as into how it works. Every business is hard at first but believe me it does pay off if you are consistent. I hope this helps you.

A real estate company in NYC claims to have a buyer for my many weeks at a resort close to Cancun. In the many forms they sent, there is a completed form from citibanamex, which shows the balance on Dec 28 for the agreed selling price. I have not yet signed the sales agreement, now in the final hour there is a foreign investment permit which has to be purchased before the sale can proceed. I can supposedly get this myself by getting it from the Mexican Embassy or they can get an Expiditor to process, a pin will be issued and is required before closing. Does this sound legitimate, I am absolutely not paying anything upfront, but also uneasy about this copy of a bank statement why would the funds be in the account before closing......is it a light form, I got it from the buyer company not the bank. If it is ok is it a simple affair to have funds transferred from Mexico.

peps1 wrote:

A real estate company in NYC claims to have a buyer for my many weeks at a resort close to Cancun. In the many forms they sent, there is a completed form from citibanamex, which shows the balance on Dec 28 for the agreed selling price. I have not yet signed the sales agreement, now in the final hour there is a foreign investment permit which has to be purchased before the sale can proceed. I can supposedly get this myself by getting it from the Mexican Embassy or they can get an Expiditor to process, a pin will be issued and is required before closing. Does this sound legitimate, I am absolutely not paying anything upfront, but also uneasy about this copy of a bank statement why would the funds be in the account before closing......is it a light form, I got it from the buyer company not the bank. If it is ok is it a simple affair to have funds transferred from Mexico.

Don't be a sap. There is no buyer and there is no "pending transaction". Scammers like these are a dime a dozen and their game is always very much the same. They lure you in with a baited hook --- the promise of big bucks (usually MUCH more than ANY Mexican RTU contract is worth to ANYONE). Once you bite, a contrived, bogus charge is suddenly required in order to proceed (escrow fee, tortilla tax, title fee, or some other such non-existent nonsense). Once you pay that money, the buyer "changes their mind", the transaction is dead --- and they simply disappear (along with whatever you paid, which you will never get back).

Sellers don't PAY money --- sellers RECEIVE money. BUYERS pay money. Tell these parasites to take that alleged "fee" out of your proceeds and wait for their response. The response will be either lame excuses why they can't do that --- or just "crickets". DO NOT send them ANY money.

If you proceed anyhow, you do so at your peril. Forewarned is forearmed.

I am an American citizen and worked as a "closer" for four years at both the Imperial Holiday Club (Casa Maya) , Royal Holiday Club (Cancun Sheraton) and Tucan-cun Beach Club from 1985-1989. I earned on average of $6,000.00 -$7,000.00 US/monthly which at that time was great money considering the peso was at 420. My rent was $500 US/mo. for a 2 bedroom beach front condo in the Hotel Zone KM 7.5. Life was great until Hurricane Gilbert hit in Sept. 1988. Business came to a grinding halt and the developer that I was working for, decided he was only going to pay the Mexican nationals all commissions due and screw everyone else, which he did successfully. Trying to get $4,000.00 US in commissions earned proved to be unsuccessful, so it was time for me to leave. I moved back to the US to attend law school. To make a long story short, timeshare AKA interval ownership, was a great value and was a relatively new vacation alternative. At that time , one week of timeshare sold for $3,500 for a studio, $7,500 for a 1 BD and $10-12K for a 2 BD or Villa. Any week could be exchanged using RCI. The value was all there if one vacationed and a family could legitimately save a lot of money and have a bigger and nicer play to stay in, assuming they took vacations on a yearly basis. All maintenance fees were reasonable at $150-250/week of ownership. As far a being a sales person(aka a "liner") or a manager (aka a "closer")there was no internet available to research the company you were doing business with, no negative feedback to overcome while negotiating, and there was no three day rescission clause in any Mexican contract. Once a customer had signed the contract, there was no cancellation. None. Once the client signed on the dotted line, that was it. Today, the internet has killed timeshare sales with all of the bad PR. Secondly, there is a three day rescission in all foreign contracts. Lastly, many prime weeks at popular resorts can be purchased at huge discounts on the resale market for far less as to what one would pay at the resort itself. These are the things that make selling timeshare in Mexico today, much harder than it used to be. Your success as a timeshare sales person will be your ability to successfully overcome a barrage of objections and get the client to buy TODAY, not tomorrow. Objections or concerns such as 1)I need to think about it 2) I need to go home and talk to my accountant/lawyer 3) I need to talk to my parents/kids 4)My research on the internet tells me never to make a first day buying decision in a foreign country 5) please explain all of the horror stories on the internet regarding timeshare sales in Mexico which there are many 6)why is buying form you today better than buying a resale time share for 1/2 the money in a prime location 7) how often do the maintenance fees go up(which they do all of the time) 8) why is buying a timeshare a better deal when I can book a vacation on line with Expedia (including air fare) for less money. The average timeshare cost per week in 2017 is $19,000 US with a $660/yr maintenance fee. If you buy two weeks, double all prices. In Mexico, owning a timeshare is good for only 30 years as there is no perpetuity. That's right only 30 years. Do the math. Does owning ONE week or TWO weeks of timeshare, adding in the maintenance fees and costs to exchange in RCI plus air fare, a better way to vacation?. Selling an intangible product in a third world country takes a great deal of skill. I watched many sales people who were once successful in other sales professions, fail miserably selling time share. The odds are against you but if you must, give it a try. The resort that hires you will help you with your 6 month work Visa. Speaking Spanish is a great asset but not necessary. The Latin American clientele is much easier to deal with, so speaking Spanish will greatly increase your ability to become successful. Stay safe. Cancun is not as safe as it used to be. The Mexican drug cartels are everywhere and the kidnapping of Americans for ransom happens frequently. This is something the Mexican government does not tell the public about as it does not want to kill its biggest cash cow-tourism. Good luck.

wanderings states, quoted in pertinent parts:

>> Today, the internet has killed timeshare sales with all of the bad PR. <<

Stated and viewed another way, the Internet has enabled people to become better informed in advance and less susceptible to "smoke and mirrors" or lies and deceit ---*IF* they make the effort to do some homework BEFORE parading into those sales presentations. What you refer to as "bad PR" could instead be described as "facts and the truth being exposed". It could be very easily argued that those who STILL march in and sign on the dotted line without ever having done ANY homework beforehand simply fulfill the old adage that "A fool and his money are soon parted". God helps those who help themselves...

Additionally, even the notoriously weak laws in Mexico now require that anyone executing a timeshare contract be advised, in writing at the time of contract execution, of their legal right to cancel (rescind) that contract within 5 days, with full refund of any deposit paid and without any penalty or negative consequences. No longer does a "signature on the bottom line" mean that it's a "done deal" right then and there.

> In Mexico, owning a timeshare is good for only 30 years as there is no perpetuity. <

More accurately stated, there is really no "owning" a timeshare in Mexico at all. You don't actually own ANYTHING when you sign a timeshare contract in Mexico. You own absolutely NOTHING. A "right to use" (aka RTU) contract merely provides annual ACCESS for a defined period of time --- nothing more --- and still carries with it the additional burden and obligation to pay maintenance fees in each year of use after contract execution.

>> Selling an intangible product in a third world country takes a great deal of skill. <<

Stated another way, selling timeshare RTU contracts in Mexico takes a willingness to deceive, exaggerate and misrepresent the truth to whatever extent is necessary to peddle a "product" which is inherently worthless --- and still "seal the deal" anyhow. I guess it's your prerogative to call that a "skill", but other less flattering descriptions come to mind. The entire sales process of "pitching heat" relies heavily upon the validity of that old saying which states....."A fool and his money are soon parted".

The above relevant points of observation aside, I have enjoyed reading your interesting history and I appreciate the effort made to post it (although paragraphs would have made for easier reading). Your personal experience was apparently nearly 30 years ago now, but your input still provides an interesting insight into the practices (and prices) from that long ago time period.

Personally, I wouldn't take a Mexican RTU timeshare contract for free, with $5,000 cash also handed to me right along with it (I'd maybe think about it for $10,000 cash), but to each their own. Clearly, people continue to exercise their free will and voluntarily choose to "sign on the dotted line" and....well....get "parted" from their money (see previous "fool" reference above).

Renting timeshares in Mexico (or "exchanging" into Mexican timeshares) is easy and relatively inexpensive; just as it is in Orlando or Las Vegas --- in all those instances timeshares are readily available and basically "a dime a dozen". Renting or "exchanging" there requires NO initial "buy in" and requires NO long term financial commitments or obligations.

wanderings wrote:

I earned on average of $6,000.00 -$7,000.00 US/monthly

Did you earn that being honest and professional or did you have to be like the stereotypical timeshare salesperson --- dishonest, uncourteous, unprofessional, lying (and a whole bunch of other adjectives that I will not list here)?

I ALWAYS told the truth to all of my clients. Why lie? There was no need to if you had the skills and the gift of gab. Most of my fellow associates, I can proudly say, were also on the "up and up". I was a good looking, young college grad saving money for law school. With the Sheraton name attached to our place of business, credibility and rapport was easy to establish. Most of the people I worked with, were educated, attractive, in shape and highly articulate. Many of them are very successful today in a variety of professions both here and abroad.

There was one individual that I worked with( an old timer in the time share industry) for a short period of time, that used a closing technique based on a "Two Year Trial Program". Essentially, the customer buys one or two weeks, uses it for two years, and if they don't like it, they sell it back to the developer less a $250 processing fee. This is a very shady practice which from what I hear, is still used today. Needless to say, he was eventually fired for not telling the truth to a well respected and wealthy Mexican client.

As far as actually selling time share in Cancun, it was easy for me. Location, growth and scarcity of the land (in Cancun), and getting more vacations in nicer places just made more sense to many people .Value was easy to convey. Most clients would spend $10,000 in 10 years staying in a hotel room with a double bed in a nice location. For less money, it made more sense to many people to stay in a larger accommodation with more amenities and get 20 more vacations for about the same money.

Timeshare has changed drastically in the last thirty years. Big name hotels are now selling time share. Value for some vacationers will always be there. For some, probably not. The one thing that is alarming is the number of cases of buyers remorse which is well documented on many third party web sites. Many of these customers use the excuse "he lied to me and ripped me off", when in actuality, the clients are suffering from a HUGE case of buyers remorse.They arrive home from vacation with a portfolio of paperwork after spending 20K for example, and their kids ,neighbors or co-workers tell them what fools they were for buying a timeshare. This happens ALL OF THE TIME. The clients never used the product to even see if they like it. The next thing they do is cancel and post unflattering comments about being ripped off.

I am not saying that some people were not lied to or there might have been misrepresentation in the sales process. Shame on them and exposing them is highly important. On the other hand, customers who fail to utilize the Socratic Method and/or by simply doing a few GOOGLE searches before their purchase, have only themselves to blame for the headaches they suffer.

I still own one week at the Royal Mayan which is a phenomenal place in Cancun. I usually exchange my week and travel elsewhere and stay in the nicest accommodations. For me, owning a timeshare has been great. Many of my business associates and clients also own timeshare. All of them have nothing but good things to say about using their timeshare worldwide.

On a parting note, I wish you the best as a prospective purchaser of timeshare or as a sales person entering the profession. Good luck!

Good day. Just want to ask if there is possibility to sell my time share in Mexico i am from canada . Thank you

timeshares4 wrote:

Greetings to you all,

I am a former employee of a large timeshare company in Mexico. I know all the lies, misrepresentation and deceitful sales pitch they use to scam people who purchase in good faith.

Let me explain you how it works.

The presentation would start by telling the clients that they need to give us a decision at the end. Then, we would have breakfast and ask questions as far as their traveling needs.

In the sales pitch, we were encouraged to offer a rental program (we had a training to learn how it works) where the new owner had the option to rent the weeks they would not use and use the rental money to pay for the timeshare. Also, if the client had a previous timeshare, a broker (Great Sales and Rentals*) would buy it from them so they would not accumulate timeshares. This was a big part of the sales presentation and many of my costumers were excited about these options.

I found latter these two options which made the clients very interested in becoming part of this timeshare, were blatant lies and a fraudulent sales pitch to get people to buy. Then, I started hearing rumors of colleagues making fun of costumers, jokes like "yeah! Like it is going to be rented", "suckers! They bought everything I pitch them!", or the manager stating in one of the meetings: "Sell however you can, we´ll fix it later (It made sense to me later)".

I asked around and confronted my colleagues just to find out that most people in the sales room were part of these scams. I confronted my sales manager asking him to stop this ordeal and as you might expect, he fired me.

I own a timeshare and have had great memories with my family. Even though the concept of Timeshare is good by itself, some unethical salespeople feel the need to create false expectations, exercising deceitful sales practices just to create an easy buck.

I open this forum and complaint so if you have any questions I can answer please write it down at the bottom and I will answer it with honesty and try to be of help.

*The name of the Rental Company has been change to avoid a potential law suit.

Timeshare salesman in Mexico.

sherbyo wrote:

Just want to ask if there is possibility to sell my time share in Mexico.

Please don't shoot the messenger, but chances are frankly slim to none.

Mexican RTU contracts essentially have no resale market value. In addition, some (...not all, but some) Mexican timeshare operations charge exorbitant transfer fees of several thousand dollars just to transfer the contract into another person's hands.

Your best hope may lie in advertising and offering it for free, with a pre-paid year of maintenance fees and with you offering to pay the transfer frees in order to even generate ANY interest at all. Even then, you may hear only "crickets" in response. It's easy and relatively inexpensive for people to just rent (or exchange into) timeshare weeks in Mexico, since they are basically "a dime a dozen", so there is little or no interest in acquiring the annual obligations of a contract. I can only hope that you did not pay a large amount of money for this "product" when you acquired it.

On the other hand, if you should decide to simply NOT pay another penny, there is absolutely NOTHING that a timeshare entity in Mexico can or will do about that, except to terminate your contract and access priviliges (...so what?). After all, you don't actually OWN anything there, you merely have a "right to use" (RTU) contract --- they will keep selling such contracts to anyone else who comes along and "signs".

Thank you for your reply, me and my partner paid full amount for it $17,000 for 30yrs. Just want to know if u know any legit agency that i can contact to try resell it. Even if we don't get the full amount already? Thank you