Marriott Going to Point Syst

Legacy owners should seriously start talking about a "class action lawsuit" against MVCI. This point system is NOT what you bought into. The new system has de-vauled your property. The fear of this lawsuit is why Marriott spun-off the timeshare business. Meanwhile, a new stream of "suckers" pardon the harshness are lining up to buy points for $1.00 each so, they can re-sale for $0.53 each. Anyone interested in buying a deed to the Brooklyn Bridge>

Greetings, I was wondering if others have noticed that Marriott Rewards Points, resulting from stays in a Marriott hotel or provided in exchange for Marriott timeshare use transfer to MVCI, can no longer be used for MVCI stays? I saw this on my MVCI account when I was looking at my options for 2012 use/exchange.

If this is true, then Marriott has indeed changed the deeded owner benefits/options by locking out our Rewards Points from use at timeshare properties.

Hope I read this foot-note incorrectly, but need feedback or actual experience.

thx

Erman

I do not believe this is a change. I do not believe you could use "Rewards" points for Marriott timeshares even prior to the new program.

Can anyone confirm that they did this in the past?

In 2004 or 2005 when I first purchased my OceanWatch week, I did use the Marriott's rewards pts (150 000pts) to go to the marriott's Aruba. A few years ago I tried to do the same & was told by owners servises that it was no longer possible...

Talked to a MVC rep today and was told that 20 percent of legacy owners bought additional points. I asked if that wasn't rather low and she said they were actually only expecting that 10 percent of them would do so. Not sure what this says other than most legacy owners don't see the benefits of same.

I suspect that many owners enrolled their weeks in the VCP Destinations program as we did. It also appears that few timeshare owners are buying VCP (vacation club points). We also decided to decline purchase of VCP's and the more I find out, the better I feel about this decision.

While the VCP program does provide another use option, the VCP option does not provide fair value for most weeks tendered. For example, a Platinum Newport Coast Villa week renders 3,475 VCP points but from 4,225 to 4,725 points are required to acquire this week. Shrinkage in value ranges from 22 to over 35% for Newport. This may be limited to prime properties such as Newport, Hawaii, etc.

The good news for "week owners" is that existing timeshare owners own weeks that can be used in a number of ways not available to VCP owners (Access to "our" weeks, Interval trades, rentals, etc.). Further, the cost of acquiring our weeks was much less than the cost of points sufficient to acquire equivalent weeks using VCP's. VCP maintenance fees also seem to be higher at 40 cents per point.

I suspect that week owners who really study the VCP Destinations program will be reluctant to buy the VCP's. Some may even buy weeks in the secondary market for properties they really like (and will use) at "huge" discounts.

In summary, I believe week owners win in this deal.

ermanc wrote:

Greetings, I was wondering if others have noticed that Marriott Rewards Points, resulting from stays in a Marriott hotel or provided in exchange for Marriott timeshare use transfer to MVCI, can no longer be used for MVCI stays? I saw this on my MVCI account when I was looking at my options for 2012 use/exchange.

If this is true, then Marriott has indeed changed the deeded owner benefits/options by locking out our Rewards Points from use at timeshare properties.

Hope I read this foot-note incorrectly, but need feedback or actual experience.

thx

Erman

Erman:

The answer is Yes and the answer is No.

YES answer: We may currently use Rewards Points (we couldn't for a few years) to stay at a Marriott timeshare (MVCI) but please realize the points are now based on the category, just like the hotels are a category 1-7 or 8. You will notice that it takes a very large number of points for a week at MVCI, typically a category 6 or 7. These can be found on the Marriott web site.

NO answer: You can not use your points from the resort you own that you traded into Marriott Reward points to now go back to your home resort. (Who would want to anyway? The points are not even close.)

Another partial NO answer: I've had many Marriott employees tell me that these are very seldom available for Rewards points, especially where owners return to their home resort most of the time. I asked how/when you could best get a villa and they said in the off-season or at a resort that is not as in demand.

Hope this helps!

kathyw84 and others,

Thanks for the feedback. I was worried Marriott was locking out Reward points use at MVCI properties to drive membership in the Destination Points program. I realize the timeshare availability for Reward Points use is oftern limited, but was one way to visit a resort for less than seven days priort DP program arriving.

Thanks,

Erman

can individuals purchase marriott points from a reseller?

johng1066 wrote:

can individuals purchase marriott points from a reseller?

It is my understanding from speaking with MVCI that you can purchase DC points from a person as a "use". In other words as if you were renting a week.

They told me that you can not resell them permanently, they revert to Marriott. As with all information from Marriott, this is only fact if it is in writing. So, check the ownership paperwork to be sure.

Marriott reward points can not be sold. They can be gifted but Marriott is very suspicious of this so take care. We gifted some rewards points one time and Marriott locked up our account until we called and verified we knew the person we were sending the points to.

lichael wrote:

johng1066 wrote:

can individuals purchase marriott points from a reseller?

It is my understanding from speaking with MVCI that you can purchase DC points from a person as a "use". In other words as if you were renting a week.

They told me that you can not resell them permanently, they revert to Marriott. As with all information from Marriott, this is only fact if it is in writing. So, check the ownership paperwork to be sure.

Marriott reward points can not be sold. They can be gifted but Marriott is very suspicious of this so take care. We gifted some rewards points one time and Marriott locked up our account until we called and verified we knew the person we were sending the points to.

Wow. Who were you speaking to at Marriott? Sales rep? Customer service?

Not too sure why anyone would want to "own" points if one cannot sell them at some time into the future. What if there was a financial emergency or a real need to no longer have the obligation of point ownership - especially if you were financing your purchase? Most forms of "deeded" real estate ownership provide one with the ability to sell the asset they own for what ever reason.

Appears Marriott will let you "check in" to its Destinations program - it just won't let you "check out."

I talked with a rep at the destinations phone number (888-682-4862). He told me that purchasers of Destination Points can sell them on the open market for whatever someone is willing to pay for them. However, Marriott has the right to purchase them at that same price -- called a first right of refusal.

Marriott has done a HORRIBLE job of communicating many elements of this new program and still put out wrong info. However, the above passes the common sense test.

j227 wrote:

I talked with a rep at the destinations phone number (888-682-4862). He told me that purchasers of Destination Points can sell them on the open market for whatever someone is willing to pay for them. However, Marriott has the right to purchase them at that same price -- called a first right of refusal.

Marriott has done a HORRIBLE job of communicating many elements of this new program and still put out wrong info. However, the above passes the common sense test.

I might humbly submit that if Marriott had any common sense it would not have rolled out such an ill-conceived idea as Destinations Points.

Additionally, if one reviews the purchaser documentation - it does tend to indicate the comments noted by lichael that Marriott intends to greatly restrict transfer/ selling of Destination Points.

rm5 wrote:

Wow. Who were you speaking to at Marriott? Sales rep? Customer service?

Not too sure why anyone would want to "own" points if one cannot sell them at some time into the future. What if there was a financial emergency or a real need to no longer have the obligation of point ownership - especially if you were financing your purchase? Most forms of "deeded" real estate ownership provide one with the ability to sell the asset they own for what ever reason.

Appears Marriott will let you "check in" to its Destinations program - it just won't let you "check out."

I will admit it was a salesperson that told me this information. Sales people are not the most reliable source for Marriott information.

It seemed "unfair" that you could purchase them but not sell them. But (and I could be remembering this incorrectly) I seem to remember reading that Disney did this too. I know they are completely different company. However, there seems to be a trend in the market if that is the case.

Either way it all comes down to what the contract says when you purchase them.

Totally agree the New Points program was poorly conceived. All they had to do is keep selling deeded weeks and add the points program as an option like they have for deeded owners. There is a big difference between one points program and running one one for deeded owners and another for New Points owners. This program is not designed for owners. It was designed to make Marriott money. The problem is it is hard to make money trying to sell points at a redicilous price -- and an even more ridiculous mtce fee. I very much like the points option for deeded owneres. I very much don't like how they have communicated the program or only selling points going forward.

I believe the new program was concieved to relieve Marriott of excess inventory in a bad economy, a wind down exit strategy. If there were also troubled properties, this resolves that inventory by blending it in with some good properties. VCP or Destinations buyers are sold on the dream, not on what properties are actually included in the trust.

For example, the trust inventory at inception includes 31 different timeshare properties or 364 annual units of 52 weeks each. However, eleven (11) of these timeshare properties account for 336 annual units (92% of the trust inventory) leaving just 8% of the inventory spread over the remaining 20 properties.

The trust includes only 129 annual units (out of 364) of what I consider prime year-round properties (Hawaii and Newport Coast, CA). For those who like Florida, there are also 73 annual units in Florida. Just over half of the trust inventory is in Hawaii, Newport Coast, and Florida. The issue then is what is the rest of the stuff in the Trust - subpar properties, bad weeks, etc.? Remember, the trust is filled with unsold weeks as of a particular start date.

I don't know if this helps anyone, but it helped me to understand why Marriott needs "owners" to enroll their weeks. I also expect that Marriott got full retail value for some less desirable inventory.

Where did you get the data on the number of units in the Trust Points program and where they are located?

Full detail is included in a disclosure document required for sales of VCP units in CA - 100 plus page document. Marriott sales personnel provide this.

dennish144 wrote:

I believe the new program was concieved to relieve Marriott of excess inventory in a bad economy, a wind down exit strategy. If there were also troubled properties, this resolves that inventory by blending it in with some good properties. VCP or Destinations buyers are sold on the dream, not on what properties are actually included in the trust.

For example, the trust inventory at inception includes 31 different timeshare properties or 364 annual units of 52 weeks each. However, eleven (11) of these timeshare properties account for 336 annual units (92% of the trust inventory) leaving just 8% of the inventory spread over the remaining 20 properties.

The trust includes only 129 annual units (out of 364) of what I consider prime year-round properties (Hawaii and Newport Coast, CA). For those who like Florida, there are also 73 annual units in Florida. Just over half of the trust inventory is in Hawaii, Newport Coast, and Florida. The issue then is what is the rest of the stuff in the Trust - subpar properties, bad weeks, etc.? Remember, the trust is filled with unsold weeks as of a particular start date.

I don't know if this helps anyone, but it helped me to understand why Marriott needs "owners" to enroll their weeks. I also expect that Marriott got full retail value for some less desirable inventory.

Could not have said it better myself.

The Destinations program is only "efficient" if Legacy (Floating week) owners sign up ..... but more importantly turn their weeks in for points. So far this has been problematic for Marriott. Not a significant number of owners have signed up for Destinations Exchange - and far fewer are assigning weeks for points.

Most of the Trust properties were acquired at the top of the market - and once customers (owners and sales prospects) refused to pay Marriott's high asking prices, the company had to find an innovative way to sell its inventory (without loosing its shirt) - and thus the great idea, Destination Points, was conceived.

Unfortunately for consumers this program has a lot of room for over embellishment - and lack of full disclosure by its sales operation.

Just returned from a week at Palm Desert where (we own 2 deeded weeks) and I couldn't agree with you more. We are interested in purchasing another Marriott week and all they are 'selling' is 'points' ... which I/we also felt were way too expensive and did not equate into a week's usage at most other times/destinations as we're presently able to do at low fees thru Interval. Also spoke with several other owners during our stay and contrary to the sales pitch, no one we met bought into the points ... figuratively or literally. I too believe a class action suit should ensue but I am not an attorney ...