Marriott Going to Point Syst

thomasn15

Sure sounds like your "sales rep" just wanted to make a sale and earn his commission by telling you a line about "exchange points" never being eligible to use in future properties. First of all easy to say since there are no new properties that have started since last Jun when the trust was created. I don't recall seeing any such condition in the online by-laws either. It might be worth a call to corporate to double check and if it is indeed just a sales technique/"white lie" that person should be reported as unethical.

Thanks to everyone, as always, as we try to figure all of this out.

We were definitely told that "a point is not a point". We were told there are "trust points" (i.e., newly purchased points), and "exchange points" (i.e., Legacy owners turning their units in for points). We were also told that exchange points cannot be used for trust point inventory (which includes any future new properties as well as unsold property inventory).

Whether all this is true or simply a salesperson trying to make a sale, we do not know.

thomasn15

If indeed the salesperson is correct, that legacy owners can only exchange between other legacy owner's exchange points then I do not understand how or why a trust points owner can trade into the pool of exchange points. Seems like a double standard that only favors the trust points owners.

If the two pools of points are actually separate and will always remain that way then at least the legacy (weeks) exchange points are only traded between other legacy owners. Trust points owners would be limited to just inventory sales since last Jun 2010 and future resorts.

The one exception would be if the legacy (weeks) owner joined the Trust with a purchase of Trust points. Which as you salesperson described allow all that owner's legacy/exchange points to trade into the Trust pool as well.

Perhaps I understand the system a bit better and see how Marriott is encouraging weeks owners to buy into the Trust. I for one would wait for more Trust inventory/properties to be established first.

Can anyone tell me if I buy Trust pts in the future, will my resale weeks bought after June 20th be enrolled?

Also will we be able to buy pts on the resale market? Can people even sell their pts on the resale market?

We just enrolled in March during the sale presentation at Ocean Pointe. The sales rep did say that if we bought Trust pts it would protect all our Legacy pts. I did not really get into that topic at the time because i honestly did not want to buy more pts. And the Trust pts have already gone up in price since our last presentation! thanks

pea shell game!

and there is no chance to win!

Hi All:

I just went to the Destination Points presentation in Aruba Surf Club and I am not happy. Our representaive explained that Marriot wanted to cure some problems in the current system to provide owners more flexibility and fairness. These obviously are admirable goals, howver the solution does not appear to be fair.

The bottom line to me appears to be that we are giving up value. When we convert our weeks to points, we will not have enough points to get our week back. We may only be able to get 5 nights at the resorts that we bought a week at. For this privledge, (and some other benefits), we get to pay $695 (for 2 units) and pay an annual fee.

During our presentation, we asked the sale rep to show us how many points it would take to get a week at certain resorts that we were considering. In each case, we did not have enough points. I asked if we could access the Destination program website to review it in more detail and I was told that it was available on the website but I have not been able to find it yet. If anyone kknows how to get access to this info beforeyou enter the program, please let me know. From reading the blogs, I have learned that there is a two tiered system for people who buy into the program directly and for those who convert their weeks into points. This was never disclosed in the meeting. We are going to wait it out and continue to trade through II and see how the system works.

Learning about the new program and trying to comprehend it, took some of the enjoyment out of the vacation.

"When we convert our weeks to points, we will not have enough points to get our week back. "

True, but if you want to use your home resort week as in the past you can - conversion to points is optional.

Seen talk of the "two tier" points system, can't find it in any of the Marriott docs tho'. Anyone ?

You get links to all the docs when you start the online enrollment procedure, you don't commit to anything to see them of course. Also you'll see points charts for all resorts as well as a button in upper right that says "What is My Week Worth".

I haven't enrolled but am strongly considering it because of the increased flexibility (and enrollment fee stays at $595/695 until end of June) but I'll still be able to book my home resort week the normal way.

We are not Marriott owners but our resort is changing over to points and when asked if we had any interest in changing over we had no problem saying NO!

In my opinion when you own and have the deed you own something. With points you own what ever the resorts decide your point value is worth at that time. Points may start off strong but as all of us old timer timeshare owners have seen the point value's change and it seems to always favor the resort so they can sell you more points. I will keep our week and always trade for a week.

PHILL12

If you enroll in the new Marriott system you still keep your deed. You just gain the option to convert a week into points for that year.

For those posting about "New" points vs. "Legacy Points" and the salesmen's tactics, these guys explain it well.

http://tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=144695

KathyW , sorry havent been getting alerts about this forum, havent been on. Answering your question, it is still my understanding that if you are only a points owner, you can only reserve inventory that is part of that system. So, lets say at Grand Ocean, Marriott would have to repurchase, repossess, or otherwise again own some of that inventory to place it in the "trust" system. I do not believe that if my deeded inventory is "converted" to points for any given year it is available to anyone but another "deeded owner" that joined the points program (enrolled). I do believe that if you are a "both" owner, deeded and purchase points, you have additional options but the way points are reserved at a deeded resort may be "split" between two different kinds of inventory. Someone on this post experienced that not long ago. I think that showed up somewhere between pages 15 and 18......

Just went thru the presentation in Kauai. Fortunately our radar was going off and we declined. Afterward we found: 1) we would not be able to get back into either timeshare here with the points that they were offering. 2) we would now be in a pool of people reserving the same property. good luck in getting back in! 3) it appears that a number of new properties are upgraded and require a bunch more points, even though the properties may be nicer the locations are definitely not!

This is the first time I've ever felt really pressured to do a deal with Marriott, which is one of the reasons we bought. It even felt like going to a car dealership with the passing off to layers of managers. Bottom line - I've always felt highly about Marriott and their programs, but this has caused me to seriously question the direction and my level of trust has dropped from 100% to almost zero. How bad can bad be and how fast can trust be lost - I think Marriott has set an all time record!

markb750 thanks for sharing the presentation you just experienced in Kauai. Not a good sign for one of their better locations to be using just pressure tactics. It might be more expected in a low demand location, but Hawaii seems out of sorts. It seems the points product itself has now made Marriott's prime locations more difficult to sell. Assuming the client could afford to buy, I would guess high press was not required when actual weeks were still being sold.

On a different note, is the deadline for enrolling our pre-Jun 2010 weeks still 31 Jun 2011? Haven't heard much discussion on how the trends are going in enrollment.

Appreciate any inputs?

Erman

markb750 .. your comment not clear, are you a "legacy" owner, resale buyer or ??? If you're a "legacy owner" you can always reserve your week the old way at your "home" resort.

ermanc- June 20 sticks in my mind as the deadline tho' it may be extended as it has been once already.

From Marriott's site:

"As an Owner who purchased prior to the launch of Marriott Vacation Club Destinations™, you have the option to enroll in an exchange program providing for your existing use options plus access to the Marriott Vacation Club Destinations Exchange Program with an additional use election, Vacation Club Points.

For a limited time, you can enroll your first week purchased directly from Marriott Vacation Club International in the Exchange Program for only $595 (or $695 for more than one week).

Weeks purchased externally before June 20, 2010 may be enrolled for $1,495 for the first week or $1,995 for more than one week. Weeks purchased externally, with a deed recording date after June 20, 2010 are not eligible for enrollment in the Exchange Program. "

I own a low season legacy week at Marriott Desert Springs and have not yet opted to join the new points program. I don't think I would benefit from it, since my lowly week is worth so few points each year-1875.

I virtually never use my assigned week at MDS: I always split my deposits into two weeks by using the Lock-off option, and use Interval International for two weeks of exchange per year. I sometimes trade back in to MDS during a nicer season. I also use II frequently for their inexpensive Getaways.

The main concern I have is losing availability of Marriott properties through II. Please fill me in if I'm missing something else that would affect my situation. Given all the above, it seems I should just keep things as is. (no points)

In your situation, I agree.

arindasue wrote:

I own a low season legacy week at Marriott Desert Springs and have not yet opted to join the new points program. I don't think I would benefit from it, since my lowly week is worth so few points each year-1875.

I virtually never use my assigned week at MDS: I always split my deposits into two weeks by using the Lock-off option, and use Interval International for two weeks of exchange per year. I sometimes trade back in to MDS during a nicer season. I also use II frequently for their inexpensive Getaways.

The main concern I have is losing availability of Marriott properties through II. Please fill me in if I'm missing something else that would affect my situation. Given all the above, it seems I should just keep things as is. (no points)

Although I own two Red (top season) weeks at MDSV I which until last year or so, traded beautifully,I have the same concern about continued availability of Marriott properties through II. When I spoke with II recently, they denied any recent or future change in Marriott inventory, property or seasons that would be available through II (while husseling me to renew while I have seven months left on my current II membership). Having said that, I have not been able to book into numerous Marriott properties through II even many months in advance. Either the inventory isn't being deposited as it once was, or there are 'tiers' of access. Given that II now has THREE membership levels (Platinum is the newest & boasts getting first notice of availabilities - at least the Getaways, & for a whopping $159/169 over the standard membership fee!), it seems that 'something has to give'. Even the selection of Getaway inventory is considerably more limited than in the past.

Except for the greater flexibility of using less than a week at a time, we cannot see the value in paying $2000 (1 original deed & one from a third party), + the various annual fees in addition to the usual ever-increasing maintenance fees, to get points that are structured in a punitive way. Whoever at Marriott came up with the idea that surrenduring 7 days during prime season at a prime resort would not get you 7 days trading power even back in to your own resort, should be taken out behind the barn, and, well.... A hairbrained, ill-conceived, arrogant scheme that thanks its owners by screwing them. We are SO sorry that we purchased a second week in 2010 just 2 months before the **** hit the fan.

Sorry about waxing on. I've been reading these mostly-helpful blogs for months & finally I feel compelled to chime in. Yes, please, if any of you can shed light on the Marriott-II relationship & what we may expect, at least 2 of us would love to hear.

Thank you.

Hi arindasue, evlevin and all, It has been a while since we went to listen about the new point system. But we were told very clearly by the sales person that the inventory available to II was definitely going to be reduced. He told us that in the past any unreserved inventory was turned over to II for exchanges and that was going to stop.

Having said that, here is what we are trying to do now after the system has changed that worked for us before they changed it.

We deposited our week and have a request for trade which is pending. It has been about a month since the request has been put in. It is for a partial unit at the Grand Vista high demand season to a larger unit at Oceana Palms in a lower demand season.

Even though the unit sizes are not equal the difference in seasons has always allowed this to work this out with exchanges with II.

So, I am not sure if the availability is not there or if II has tightened down the trading for equal sized units. Either way it is not working so far.

Another thing we did try to do is some shorter notice exchanges for equal to equal earlier in the year and they did not go through at all. That could have been availability of deposited units (people actually using their home resort) or the new system.

There are so many unknowns and different variables to the exchanges we don't have a clear picture as to why there seems to be a much lower amount of available units to trade lately.

Another executive at Marriott told me that there are fewer deposits because the economy has caused people to do more drive to vacations. Which is supposed to mean that people are using the main land resorts more. Therefore there is less availability.

I don't know if I agree that equals the same lack of availability. It doesn't seem to be the same thing to me. Not everyone has purchase the main land locations or goes to the location that they purchased. But maybe there is a correlation.

I am not sure if I just muddied the waters with our experience or helped. I hope it helped.

Thanks for your responses. Are either of you owners in the points system, or, like me, do you still just own your week?

We're still wondering if there's any reason for us to switch to points, given the low value of our week.

I enrolled both my Desert Springs week and my Newport Coast weeks into the points program but after trying to "buy in" with the points to a week in Hawaii and realizing how truly expensive that is, I realize that I am better off splitting the Desert Springs week up into two (via the lockoff) and trading, via II, into Hawaii within 60 days of the time I want to vacation there. Doing that provided me a week at Ko Olina and a week at Maui Ocean Club (new towers) for this June and July. And I still have my Newport Coast weeks to trade later or to just use (which we generally do). I guess the only "gain" from having enrolled into the points program is that there was no additional cost to lockoff the Desert Springs property, and no fees to book the Hawaii properties. To me, the points could only be valuable when wanting to book much more in advance, but then I have to be prepared to give up a lot to get a little.

Like mark2769 we enrolled in the points system as well but find using them very disproportionate (turning in our weeks for points versus what we can get on a trade).

We also have had better luck with lock offs and exchanges with II. As mark2769 said the fees are covered for the lock offs and if you go to another Marriott the exchanges are covered as well. That is worth more than what is paid in the annual fee for being in the points system.

But the point exchange is not worth the trade if you want a week. Even the short stay during the middle of the week option using points is not good.

For us, if we use our points for something like that, we end up with points left over that will not get us a stay anywhere (That is a long story) and they will expire if not used. Points can only be drawn from the future and not saved into future use.