Be careful about taking advice from the Timeshare Users Group (TUG)

@ Tracey:

"I am an owner, no I am the friend of an owner."

I'm sure you saw the post on TUG where I apologized for the misinformation.

"There are plenty of lawyers who will take on a case because if they get to arbitration than DRI will pay all the fees but DRI will almost never let it get to arbitration."

That is correct. DRI stops the arbitration by settling. But it is up to the client whether to accept a settlement offer. If DRI doesn't want to include the attorney fees in the settlement, the client doesn't have to settle.

"Never pay upfront because there are lawyers who only charge the small retainer and then will work on contingency only, except that if you are out of state then they may need you to pay up front."

You are confused. I said that at one time I advised people not to pay any up front fee. I have revised that advice. No attorney should be doing work he may never get paid for. Things happen in life. Plaintiffs back out or even die. If someone is trying to recover $20,000 or more and get out of the future maintenance fees, I think it's reasonable to ask him to provide the lawyer with some security. And by the way, I don't think the timeshare rescue scams have been perpetrated by licensed attorneys have they? Haven't they usually been non-attorney businesses that claimed they could get you out of debt or get you a surrender? THOSE are the guys you do not want to pay up front. It should be safe to pay a licensed attorney.

"I want to have a website for firms with verified testimonials, but because of non disclosure clauses that can't really happen."

I never said it can't happen. It certainly can and it will. A person is free to go on line and say they used a particular lawyer and that they were happy with the outcome of the case. They just can't give any details of the settlement.

"There are so many cons in the timeshare biz but I am not a con and you should take my word even though I can't provide any proof (which is what every TS con would pretty much say)."

I never said any of that. I don't expect anyone to blindly take my word for anything.

"My advice if you want to go that route would be if you already have an attorney that you trust, run it by him and her and see what he thinks and if he could point you in some kind of direction or if you have some kind of legal benefit as part of a work benefit with a free half hour consultation try running it by that service."

People need all the advice they can get to make an informed decision. Free advice is a great place to start. Get all of the free consultations you can get and ask every question you can think of. Go to the legal forums on the net that offer free advice. Just know you cannot blindly follow anyone's advice. Know that some lawyers will have no idea what they are talking about! I know this because I've heard quite a few stories about the advice TS owners got from lawyers. For example one guy I met was told by his free half hour lawyer that he should take a surrender if he could get one. The guy was smart enough to ignore that advice and he found competent representation. A few months later he had a full refund.

Another person I met took the free advice that there was nothing he could do, so he paid $9,000 to a surrender company to get out of his contract.

"Also if you want to be helpful Susan and write up that guide you mentioned, maybe start with all the documentation an owner who is thinking about going with a lawyer (or up against the TS company on there own) should gather and what phone calls they can make and what they should say to the TS company and how to document those calls."

That is on my long list of things to do.

"That would be way more helpful than the advice to find a good attorney who may or may not charge several thousand dollars upfront."

I don't give people that advice, lol. As I said, I am thorough. I explain things. I guess I rant about them, lol!

Thank you for your time.

Susan there is no question in my mind now that you are associated with this law firm you hustling in the forum. You fit the profile of a scammer. Your long rants are a dead give away. You have a vague answer for everything and a lot of blah blah blah. You can rant all you want but if it walks like a duck and talks like a duck then it's a DUCK !!!

I would advise everyone to only have contact with you in the forum. Once a scammer isolates their victims they can run their con. You definitely don't pass the smell test and I will continue to tell people to not buy what you are selling

@Don:

"Your long rants are a dead give away."

I am wondering how many words it takes to cross the line from a "long response" to a "rant". I presume you have some type of formula but I guess that is the work product of your scam buster venture so you are not going to share it. :( Regardless, I will accept that my own posts are the "smoking rants" that serve as clear and convincing evidence of my skulduggery, lol.

A person has to have a sense of humor about these things, but I really DO understand where you are coming from! Now for a serious comment:

"I would advise everyone to only have contact with you in the forum."

That is EXCELLENT advice. I can reach way more people and save myself a lot of time by discussing things on the forums rather than in email. It's just a matter of finding forums will allow me to exercise free speech, even if it is contrary to the forum owner's agenda. Obviously TUG won't allow that. So far so good here at Redweek, but we shall see!

Thank you for your interest. I wish you well Don and I guess I'll be seeing you in the Redweek threads!

Can anyone suggest a reliable, honest company to help me out of my timeshare....no upfront fees?

Jane

There is no company that can magically get you out of your contract . NEVER pay anyone money upfront that claims they can get you out of your contract !!

janec244 wrote:

Can anyone suggest a reliable, honest company to help me out of my timeshare....no upfront fees?

First, I'll echo Don P's comment about not paying any company any large, upfront money to get you out of your timeshare. Most will just take your money and do nothing. Others will questionably get you "out" using unscrupulous or illegal means (viking ship for example). Others will charge you thousands of dollars to do what you can do yourself with a little time and effort.

Some questions. Do you owe anything on the mortgage or maintenance fees? Make sure those are up-to-date.

If it is with Wyndham, Diamond, or Westgate, then keep in mind that these companies are offering to take back a select, limited number of units for a fee. If it is not with any of these, then try contacting your resort's Homeowners' Association (not someone at the front desk) and ask if they will take your unit back. Be firm and let them know that you will not be paying any more money in maintenance fees so it would be in everybody's best interests for the HOA to take back the unit amicably. They might ask you to pay closing costs and maybe even the next maintenance fee. But that would work out to a lot less than what these get-out-of-your-timeshare companies charge you. And you will do a sure, clean transfer without the "help" of any questionable third party.

The other suggestion that gets mentioned here is to try advertising your unit for "sale" here on RedWeek. You can also try advertising on My Resort Network, Craigslist, E-Bay, or Timeshare Users Group (ironically, the title of this thread). Timeshare Users Group (aka "TUG"; tugbbs.com) has a Bargain Deals section where you can advertise for free that you want to give away your unit. You might want to stipulate that you will pay closing costs and maybe even the next maintenance fee. Again, this will work out to a lot cheaper than paying any questionable "exit" company.

I have to agree with the above comment. Do not give up money unless the resort wants to buy it back. Also, depends on how much because you can actually do it for free.

I have worked in the timeshare business for 15 years as a sales and marketing representative in the U.S., Mexico, and Caribbean Islands and Canada.

If the resort is selling well, they should take it back for free. Why? If they can make another $20,000 on that same timeshare, why wouldn't they? If it is deeded, they need permission (free title) to resell it - even if they have to foreclose. They are not going to chase you for a maintenance fee.

Also, why do you want to get rid of it? Please share.

I share this in my upcoming book, Everything About Timeshare, Before, During and After the Sale.

For more info, visit my website...redweektimesharebook.com Separate from the Redweek organization.

Best of luck!

Solved

mariok8 wrote:

I just have purchased a exit package in Riviera Maya at vidata Mayan palace resorts which allowed me to have 100 weeks for travel but after I got home I realized that its not the same package that they have promised me in the presentation It was bunch of lies I want out and recover my money back. It has been 2 weeks do I have a chance to get a refund? those anyone know any lawyers that could help me with the case?

Very rarely do the contracts match what the sales person told you. Your chances of getting a refund are between slim and nil since you have passed your rescission period so don't hire a lawyer because a lawyer can't help you get your money back.

How much have you paid so far and how much more do you owe?

Solved

mariok8 wrote:

I paid the full amount which was around $6800 the only think that I didn't pay was the $1800 transfer of my timeshare fee which I read is another hassle of running around to grab more money from you I am still looking for lawyer and his advice will find out what has to say

Well if you've already paid the full amount, you own it. Is there any way you can make use of what you have? If not, then your best bet is just to take your loss. What you have is unsellable.

As for hiring a lawyer, it is not usually recommended on these boards to hire one for timeshare or vacation club purchases. What do you think a lawyer is going to do for you especially since your purchase, I'm assuming, is in Mexico and you probably live in a different country than Mexico. I guess you can try to get a lawyer's advice but I would not pay him anything.

Please don´t trust this Tug2 Timeshare scam group. As you can see on their website, they promote professional scammers as Licenced Timeshare Resale Broker Association, and the worst of all they advertise with a banner the Interval International which is a worldwide proven scam. Don´t you believe it? Okay... I suggest you search for the information on Google by Yourself. You can find clues anywhere on Complaints Board, Scam adviser, Trustpilot, Redweek, and TUG2 itself. Have you realized that TUG2, so as other Timeshare Scams moved their locations and change names every time their businesses are overloaded by hundreds of scam reports by timeshare owners? It´s funny and annoying at the same time don´t you think? They were Timeshare users group.com then they changed to TUGBBS, then again changed to TUG2.com and nowadays they are TUG2.net. We can see the same thing with Vidanta that turned into Mayan Palace while Diamond Resorts International changed their business name to "Inside the Gates" managed by two brilliant scammers: Craig Johnson and Bill Curtis. If you still think that I´m kidding you, then I dare you to search on Google and Bing by Yourself. There is plenty of information throughout the web, nonetheless, if you don´t use the Search Engines correctly then you will not find the information to verify what I state here.

susanb1439 wrote:

TUG purports to be an unbiased website dedicated to helping consumers. It has long been rumored that TUG is very biased in favor of TS developers. Certainly the policies on that site indicate they are more interested in protecting the TS developers than the consumers.

I am one of several people involved in a long term investigation of DR. I been trying to network with DRI owners on TUG, asking for them to share information about their DRI experiences. The TUG moderators immediately decided I was involved in some nefarious activity and they prevented me from starting new threads to discuss DRI. Today one of the moderators announced he was certain that I am "promoting for an attorney" and he commented that "the truth always comes out". With that context in mind, here is the post that caused them to ban me:

I am not "promoting" for any particular attorney. I am a consumer rights activist (currently focused on TS), I help TS victims, I don't charge anyone a dime, and I don't receive any type of compensation from attorneys.

It would be easy enough for you to confirm that by contacting me as a victim asking for help. Surely if I am doing what you claim I'm doing, it wouldn't take long for you to obtain evidence of that. But you know that don't you?

Over the past seven months I've been contacted by many, many people asking for help. A handful of them have disappeared after exchanging several emails with me. I assume these people were "testers" and I suspect some of them were TUGGERS. Yet in all this time, not one person has appeared on any forum to warn others that am doing anything other than exactly what I say I am doing.

I work at least sixty hours a week investigating DRI and helping the individuals that contact me. I've heard from quite a few people while they are still in their rescission period. I literally drop whatever I am doing to send them rescission instructions. I've discovered that some victims need more than written instructions so I walk them through the process until they have their notice in the mail.

I am promoting something though. I want people to know that it is a myth, mainly perpetuated by TUG, that the only way out of a TS is a surrender. That is one of the most ridiculous things I've ever heard. I hate to think how many people have walked away from tens of thousands of dollars based on the advice that is routinely given here.

I hope to identify a number of attorneys that are willing to represent TS victims on a contingency basis or for a small payment with the retainer agreement. I intend to create a list of those attorneys and publish it on a website where people can comment on their experiences with each attorney.

I know TUG has heard from people that obtained satisfactory results (cancellation WITH a refund) by using an attorney. TUG should be happy to hear about such attorneys and anxious to publish their names. But you haven't done that. You won't even let your users recommend an attorney by name. All this time, you could have been making it easy for people to find the attorneys they need. Instead you act like you are afraid for that information to come out.

You are also determined to prevent me and presumably anyone else, from reaching out to your members for information or help with our DRI investigation.

Taken together these facts indicate TUG is interested in protecting TS developers from lawsuits. That is a very unusual stance for people that profess to be interested in helping consumers. I wonder what "truth" is behind that agenda.

_____________________________________________________________________________________________ I am sharing this incident here, because it is evidence of some serious truth! TUG is 20 years old and now boasts 70,000 members. When a dissatisfied owner that has already missed the rescission period comes to TUG and asks for advice, they get two suggestions. 1. Accept that you can't get out and learn to enjoy the vacations even though they are costing you much more than they are worth. 2. Surrender your purchase and take a total loss on the tens of thousands of dollars you paid for it.

TUG tells people there is no other option. Clearly, as evidenced by the fact that I've been banned, the site does not allow people to post about other solutions! This is why you don't hear from more of the people that DO get their money back. People that deviate from TUG's agenda are likely to be censored. sbharbison@gmail.com

rhondaa87 wrote:

Please don´t trust this Tug2 Timeshare scam group. As you can see on their website, they promote professional scammers as Licenced Timeshare Resale Broker Association, and the worst of all they advertise with a banner the Interval International which is a worldwide proven scam. Don´t you believe it? Okay... I suggest you search for the information on Google by Yourself. You can find clues anywhere on Complaints Board, Scam adviser, Trustpilot, Redweek, and TUG2 itself. Have you realized that TUG2, so as other Timeshare Scams moved their locations and change names every time their businesses are overloaded by hundreds of scam reports by timeshare owners? It´s funny and annoying at the same time don´t you think? They were Timeshare users group.com then they changed to TUGBBS, then again changed to TUG2.com and nowadays they are TUG2.net. We can see the same thing with Vidanta that turned into Mayan Palace while Diamond Resorts International changed their business name to "Inside the Gates" managed by two brilliant scammers: Craig Johnson and Bill Curtis. If you still think that I´m kidding you, then I dare you to search on Google and Bing by Yourself. There is plenty of information throughout the web, nonetheless, if you don´t use the Search Engines correctly then you will not find the information to verify what I state here.

As I addressed recently in great detail in another thread in this same forum (that other thread is entitled "Is TUG helpful?"), the above quoted post is just pure crap and illogical nonsense. It is factually inaccurate and replete with various completely irrelevant rants and asides. Enough said.

TUG2 or Timeshare Users Group is the pitfall that timeshare owners did not realize because of lack of information. But I must share with you that if you own a timeshare and you´re afraid of scams or the so-called phony calls reported by BBB some time ago, you should then take precautions with those sites TUG or Redweek because this businesses have the only function of drawing in people to their "club" to collect their private data. TUG2 or Redweek will not call you anytime, but their associates will. Data are sent to Interval International, Wyndham or others we do not even suspect. Those might be disposable companies that disappear the day after they took your money.

I don´t say I got documented and tangible proves but please consider that this might be happening right now while you read this,

I was a Timeshare Owner, and I was a victim of scams too. I had a very tough lesson, and I learned how to avoid scams and with the help of my attorney I got out of the Timeshare Contract. It took more than five months of efforts and money, but it finally worked. My recommendation to all of you is: Hire an attorney and get out of TUG2 as soon as possible.

oldhamj wrote:

Hire an attorney and get out of TUG2 as soon as possible.

Why would one need to hire an attorney to get out of TUG2? TUG is simply a public forum where people can discuss the ins and outs of timeshares and traveling. The other part of it is a listing service that allows owners to list their units for sale or rent. It only costs about $15 per year. So if you're not happy with it, is it really worth contacting an attorney to get you out of a $15 contract? Or am I misinterpreting your post?

Oldham, I have not seen such crap in a long time. Tug does not solicit members, nor sell their info. I have been a member for over 5 years. I do not own a timeshare. I have rented timeshares. In all the time I have been a member of Tug, I have NEVER received any marketing material or communications from any companies in the industry. Tug facilitates rentals, as well as purchases - and has forums with topics chosen by the members. It also has a compendium of information available for those who don't understand the individual companies. Tug is a RESOURCE. Take your paranoia someplace else.

Oldham J.: Your statement regarding RedWeek sharing user data is simply not accurate. As stated in our Privacy Policies (https://www.redweek.com/privacy), RedWeek does not sell, rent, or give away any user information (and never has) except in cases where you specifically request it.

If you have any questions or would like more clarification, please feel free to use the "Contact Us" link at the bottom of any page.

Hello, I would like to talk with you about the tactics of TS. You have my email. Thank you.