Manhattan Club Lawsuit

very difficult to obtain reservations within 90 days, must make reservations a year in advance, your plan change you lost any chance to make a reservation with-in a year

Steven and Marlene Levinson

Attention all interested owners. The March 31 hearing on legal fees has been postponed to June 29. For those planning on attending the March 31 hearing, stay home.

According to the March 22nd court-approved stipulation about the postponement, the court agreed to delay the oral arguments so both parties can continue "settlement negotiations." No information was provided about how broad those negotiations are, or over what they cover.

Current focus of the June 29 hearing is the Eichner request to unfreeze club assets in order to pay legal fees. In a nutshell, it appears that the club wants to use operating revenues, including owner maintenance fees that pay for operations, to subsidize the Eichners' legal team as they continue to defend against the AG's investigation of possible wrongdoing at the club.

The settlement talks, as noted by another owner in a prior post on this forum, could moot the pending motion. According to attorneys contacted about this case, an ultimate disposition, or settlement, of the AG's investigation would likely address and resolve attorney fee issues.

RedWeek will keep owners posted of additional developments as they surface.

The attorneys handling this matter for the AG's office are Louis M. Solomon and Matthew Woodrull, reachable at 212-416-8122. There are three attorneys of record for the Eichner defense team: Orin Snyder, Mylan L. Denerstein and Brian C. Asher, all affiliated with the Gibson, Dunn and Crutcher law firm in Manhattan. Their contact phone is 212-351-3850

Thanks, Jeff, for this very informative update. More wait and see.

Is there any reason to think if we proxy vote against current management that it will have any effect?Timeshare annual meeting is in August 2017, which should give us adequate time to spread the word.

Thanks Jeff for the informative update. To all reading this post, my strategy has been to remain true to my contractual obligations as an owner and to have confidence in our legal system. A settlement will be better for all parties caught up in this situation. Some owners say they have stopped paying maintenance fees and haven't seen their FICA scores affected yet. The AG's sales moritorium probably halted all legal actions to enforce contractual obligations on either side (owners or developer) while giving TMC time to clean up prior lax (or shady??) business practices. TMC has a high resort rating (Gold Crown) and I have definitely seen more professional, business-like management practices the past two years. There is better accounting of fees paid, and the annual shareholders meetings look like they are shaping up more along the lines of other shareholder meetings that I have attended (or proxied) with other corporations that I've been involved with.

All these legal tensions are occurring at a time when the timeshare industry is finally being taken to task for its all-around unfair business practices. I just exited my ownership in a Wyndham resort by using their newly launched Ovation program. Wyndham took back ownership at no cost to me; albeit, no "buy back" either, but at least they are doing all the legal paperwork to absolve me of my ownership obligations. With another timeshare, I've paid considerable money for a third party to handle the legalities. And note: not advertise but actually handle all the legal paperwork that is involved when one buys an interest in real estate. TMC is my 3rd and final timeshare ownership. (It was the 2nd of 3 that I bought between 2003 & 2012). I cannot do anything but continue to pay (while my money lasts) or rent the reservation and re-coop some of my costs.

However TMC is resolved, I have come to understand it will set a precedent for other timeshare developers and owners to be more wise in entering this type commerce. It's been a lesson in buyer-beware in spades. I only hope sellers get the message too.

What a surprise!

With the New York AG and The Manhattan Club in "settlement negotiations" now is the time to write to the Judge and the New York AG's office. The AG's client is the State of New York. The NY AG will negotiate for the benefit of the State of New York. It is Judge Rakower who has mentioned consideration for TMC owners in her legal opinions not the New York Attorney General's office. Manhattan Club owners need to write to the Judge and to the New York Attorney General's office so Manhattan Club owners are not completely ignored in any pending settlement.

Here is the info to write:

Atty. Alyssa Rossi New York Attorney General’s Office Asst. Attorney General 120 Broadway, 23th Floor New York, NY  10271 (212) 416-6240

Honorable Justice Eileen Rakower, Supreme Court of the State of New York  71 Thomas St. Part 15 New York, New York 10013 Dear Justice Rakower: Regarding case number 451536/2014: Schneiderman vs Eichner:

Hi Irene et al,

I just called and spoke to Louis M. Sullivan at the AG's office and voiced my concerns about their possible settlement talks with TMC. He seemed surprised at my terminology and replied that they were not settling the case but pursuing it despite TMC's continual delays. He recommended that I go on the website < https://ag.ny.gov/complaint-forms > and file a complaint form so they can track all of the issues we have against TMC. The Consumer Fraud form also has an option to request how you'd like it resolved, ie, money back which was my choice. There's also a form for Price Gouging. I'd recommend that you have all of your documents in attachment form ready before you begin your entry as you submit immediately.

Mr. Sullivan also said out of state people like myself can file complaints on the website. The AG's office compiles all of our complaints as part of the evidence in their case. So that's another action we can all take in addition to contacting Judge Rakower and the attorneys mentioned.

joy

Thanks, Joy, this is very useful information. We need to fill out these forms ASAP to ensure the AG's office has mountains of evidence on their side.

I went on the site that Joy mentioned...it seems like that is starting from scratch again...Many of us have sent in several letters to the AG and the Judge already over the last 3 years. These letters are what helped the AG build their case against Eichner...and why Judge Rakower wrote in her opinions that the owners be considered in any settlement. I appreciate the input from Irene and Joy, but now am at a loss as what to do....I had already, today, written new letters to the AG and the Judge stating that we owners need to be considered in any kind of settlement as we were the ones were taken advantage of in all of this. I attached my old complaint letters for reference... I am willing to fill out these forms on line, if that is what it takes, but I want to make sure that is the next step. Maybe I will try to contact Ms. Rossi by email.

joyk42 wrote:

Hi Irene et al,

I just called and spoke to Louis M. Sullivan at the AG's office and voiced my concerns about their possible settlement talks with TMC. He seemed surprised at my terminology and replied that they were not settling the case but pursuing it despite TMC's continual delays. He recommended that I go on the website < https://ag.ny.gov/complaint-forms > and file a complaint form so they can track all of the issues we have against TMC. The Consumer Fraud form also has an option to request how you'd like it resolved, ie, money back which was my choice. There's also a form for Price Gouging. I'd recommend that you have all of your documents in attachment form ready before you begin your entry as you submit immediately.

Mr. Sullivan also said out of state people like myself can file complaints on the website. The AG's office compiles all of our complaints as part of the evidence in their case. So that's another action we can all take in addition to contacting Judge Rakower and the attorneys mentioned.

joy

Thanks. Great info. I will share. If the NY AG is in settlement negotiations with the Manhattan Club we TMC owners need to make sure our wishes and concerns are on the table and heard.

"go on the New York AG website < https://ag.ny.gov/complaint-forms > and file a complaint form so they can track all of the issues we have against TMC. The Consumer Fraud form also has an option to request how you'd like it resolved, ie, money back which was my choice. There's also a form for Price Gouging. I'd recommend that you have all of your documents in attachment form ready before you begin your entry as you submit immediately.

The AG's office compiles all of our complaints as part of the evidence in their case.

Irene Smalls

Have most of you NOT paid taxes and/or maintenance fees?

pamelag205 wrote:

Have most of you NOT paid taxes and/or maintenance fees?

I have paid maintenance and taxes all along, and used my time every year or sold the reservation (on Redweek). With legal- type obligations on both sides, I'd be hesitant to follow anyone's conscience but my own on whether to pay or not. Also, I'm a little hesitant to be a squeaky wheel with the court (judge) because courts and judges are supposed to be impartial, and they certainly can't represent owners' interests in this case.

According to Joy's statement, the person she talked to at the AG's was surprised that the AG and TMC were at the point of settlement talks and that the TMC was still using delaying tactics...I want to find out what is going on before I waste my time filling out any more forms or submitting any more letters..If I find out anything I will share otherwise I think we are still in the waiting game.

irenes93 wrote:

Thanks. Great info. I will share. If the NY AG is in settlement negotiations with the Manhattan Club we TMC owners need to make sure our wishes and concerns are on the table and heard.

"go on the New York AG website < https://ag.ny.gov/complaint-forms > and file a complaint form so they can track all of the issues we have against TMC. The Consumer Fraud form also has an option to request how you'd like it resolved, ie, money back which was my choice. There's also a form for Price Gouging. I'd recommend that you have all of your documents in attachment form ready before you begin your entry as you submit immediately.

The AG's office compiles all of our complaints as part of the evidence in their case.

Irene Smalls

Have not paid them a dime for 3 years.

We have continued to pay all fees and have been exchanging

I have not paid maintenance fees for the last few years and will NOT give them anymore of my money. My credit score remains a pristine 841, so no negative consequences so far. Since this legal battle ensued I have utilized the strongest power I have, which is to hold on to my money. I hope and pray this nightmare ends sometime in the near future, though I don't have a lot of faith that it will.

I agree, Jill S, that we must all follow our own conscience on what actions we take here. I quit paying all fees because TMC broke our contractual agreement by not providing me accessibility to a unit without more than a year's advance notice. Once TMC failed to meet their contracted obligation, I felt I was likewise released. I certainly cannot pay for something I do not receive. If I were able to use the unit, I would feel obligated to pay for it. I also agree that judges must be impartial. That is the reason I send my complaints, facts, and proofs of TMC wrongdoing to the AG's office and the court - not so I can be a squeaky wheel, but so they have all the facts on which to base actions and decisions. This should not undermine a judge's impartiality, but provide another window through which to view TMC operations. If TMC has treated you fairly and lived up to it's contractual obligations with you then, of course, you have nothing to complain about. Unfortunately, many of us are not that lucky.

jills465 wrote:

pamelag205 wrote:

Have most of you NOT paid taxes and/or maintenance fees?

I have paid maintenance and taxes all along, and used my time every year or sold the reservation (on Redweek). With legal- type obligations on both sides, I'd be hesitant to follow anyone's conscience but my own on whether to pay or not. Also, I'm a little hesitant to be a squeaky wheel with the court (judge) because courts and judges are supposed to be impartial, and they certainly can't represent owners' interests in this case.

I agree somewhat to this post. Unfortunately TMC has not kept up their agreement to maintain my purchase as promised. The last time I stayed at the TMC the room was dirty, the furniture was shabby, we had to continually ask for sheets, towels, etc. and the maintenance fees did not stay consistent from year to year as promised. I was told that the fees would most likely not increase too much each year and the salesman showed me the increases from prior years Just to demonstrate to me that the increases were nominal. Additionally, I was never told that these units would be rented out to the public just like a hotel. I was told that only owners would be staying at the MC and my $60,000 cash purchase would be an investment in a "piece of Manhattan" which was so valuable because of the outrageous cost to own property in Manhattan. That was certainly a crock of baloney. I did the math and I can stay in an upscale clean, well maintained hotel room for less than what my maintenance fees cost me every year. I agree that you have to follow your own conscience and not follow what others are encouraging but know that you could be throwing good money after bad as well as funding Eichner's legal fees to take advantage of your good morals. I personally have no problem not paying TMC until everything is settled, if ever.

sallyw109 wrote:

I agree, Jill S, that we must all follow our own conscience on what actions we take here. I quit paying all fees because TMC broke our contractual agreement by not providing me accessibility to a unit without more than a year's advance notice. Once TMC failed to meet their contracted obligation, I felt I was likewise released. I certainly cannot pay for something I do not receive. If I were able to use the unit, I would feel obligated to pay for it. I also agree that judges must be impartial. That is the reason I send my complaints, facts, and proofs of TMC wrongdoing to the AG's office and the court - not so I can be a squeaky wheel, but so they have all the facts on which to base actions and decisions. This should not undermine a judge's impartiality, but provide another window through which to view TMC operations. If TMC has treated you fairly and lived up to it's contractual obligations with you then, of course, you have nothing to complain about. Unfortunately, many of us are not that lucky.

jills465 wrote:

pamelag205 wrote:

Have most of you NOT paid taxes and/or maintenance fees?

I have paid maintenance and taxes all along, and used my time every year or sold the reservation (on Redweek). With legal- type obligations on both sides, I'd be hesitant to follow anyone's conscience but my own on whether to pay or not. Also, I'm a little hesitant to be a squeaky wheel with the court (judge) because courts and judges are supposed to be impartial, and they certainly can't represent owners' interests in this case.

beckyf76 wrote:

i agree about 95% with you about maintenance payments . for the other 5% semi-disagreement: i pay maintence and taxes if and when i'm sure that my desired reservation times are available. in other words, i don't simply blindly pay the fees for a product that i can't get. i pay when and if it suits my convenience and i know reservations are available when i want i want tem. housekeeping has indeed become a problem issue. many suites have shabby furniture which should have been replaced years ago; some of the suite decor and equipment also in desperate need of updating as are some of the hallways. whrere besidses, helping to pay eichner's legal fees AGAINST US, are the maintenance fees going? certainly not into the overall maintenance of the property

I agree somewhat to this post. Unfortunately TMC has not kept up their agreement to maintain my purchase as promised. The last time I stayed at the TMC the room was dirty, the furniture was shabby, we had to continually ask for sheets, towels, etc. and the maintenance fees did not stay consistent from year to year as promised. I was told that the fees would most likely not increase too much each year and the salesman showed me the increases from prior years Just to demonstrate to me that the increases were nominal. Additionally, I was never told that these units would be rented out to the public just like a hotel. I was told that only owners would be staying at the MC and my $60,000 cash purchase would be an investment in a "piece of Manhattan" which was so valuable because of the outrageous cost to own property in Manhattan. That was certainly a crock of baloney. I did the math and I can stay in an upscale clean, well maintained hotel room for less than what my maintenance fees cost me every year. I agree that you have to follow your own conscience and not follow what others are encouraging but know that you could be throwing good money after bad as well as funding Eichner's legal fees to take advantage of your good morals. I personally have no problem not paying TMC until everything is settled, if ever.

sallyw109 wrote:

I agree, Jill S, that we must all follow our own conscience on what actions we take here. I quit paying all fees because TMC broke our contractual agreement by not providing me accessibility to a unit without more than a year's advance notice. Once TMC failed to meet their contracted obligation, I felt I was likewise released. I certainly cannot pay for something I do not receive. If I were able to use the unit, I would feel obligated to pay for it. I also agree that judges must be impartial. That is the reason I send my complaints, facts, and proofs of TMC wrongdoing to the AG's office and the court - not so I can be a squeaky wheel, but so they have all the facts on which to base actions and decisions. This should not undermine a judge's impartiality, but provide another window through which to view TMC operations. If TMC has treated you fairly and lived up to it's contractual obligations with you then, of course, you have nothing to complain about. Unfortunately, many of us are not that lucky.

jills465 wrote:

pamelag205 wrote:

Have most of you NOT paid taxes and/or maintenance fees?

I have paid maintenance and taxes all along, and used my time every year or sold the reservation (on Redweek). With legal- type obligations on both sides, I'd be hesitant to follow anyone's conscience but my own on whether to pay or not. Also, I'm a little hesitant to be a squeaky wheel with the court (judge) because courts and judges are supposed to be impartial, and they certainly can't represent owners' interests in this case.