Getting rid of your timeshare

I’m into day 23 of my timeshare donation. I received the contract from the closing agent and all looked very similar to ones Ive used for buy/sell of regular property, though not as lengthy. The costs are broken out totaling $1180, $350 of which is the escrow deposit for closing costs and to open the account. The rest is due in a few weeks. I could send it all now but that’s all they’re asking for at this point. I don’t see any mysterious fine print, a few words about what happens if I or the charity back out, or some other complication but amounts are reasonable for work done at that stage. The cover page is very clear about instructions to notarize and sign each page including short description about what happens next in completing the transfer. Should have it all put together and sent back at the beginning of the week. I spoke to the county that will record the new deed and it usually only takes them 1-3 weeks, including all the electronic updates. The usual about having signatures match exactly to the deed and the notary seals being clear were reminded. The longest time I understand is the resort doing their part to complete the transfer.

garym480 wrote:

I’m into day 23 of my timeshare donation. I received the contract from the closing agent and all looked very similar to ones Ive used for buy/sell of regular property, though not as lengthy. The costs are broken out totaling $1180, $350 of which is the escrow deposit for closing costs and to open the account. The rest is due in a few weeks. I could send it all now but that’s all they’re asking for at this point. I don’t see any mysterious fine print, a few words about what happens if I or the charity back out, or some other complication but amounts are reasonable for work done at that stage. The cover page is very clear about instructions to notarize and sign each page including short description about what happens next in completing the transfer. Should have it all put together and sent back at the beginning of the week. I spoke to the county that will record the new deed and it usually only takes them 1-3 weeks, including all the electronic updates. The usual about having signatures match exactly to the deed and the notary seals being clear were reminded. The longest time I understand is the resort doing their part to complete the transfer.

Of course, in my opinion "it's just another rip-off"! You are willing to pay a lot of money without having any guarantee, fancy paperwork does not mean anything. You should check with your resort about their policy regarding these transfers.

garym480 wrote:

I’m into day 23 of my timeshare donation. I received the contract from the closing agent and all looked very similar to ones Ive used for buy/sell of regular property, though not as lengthy. The costs are broken out totaling $1180, $350 of which is the escrow deposit for closing costs and to open the account. The rest is due in a few weeks. I could send it all now but that’s all they’re asking for at this point. I don’t see any mysterious fine print, a few words about what happens if I or the charity back out, or some other complication but amounts are reasonable for work done at that stage. The cover page is very clear about instructions to notarize and sign each page including short description about what happens next in completing the transfer. Should have it all put together and sent back at the beginning of the week. I spoke to the county that will record the new deed and it usually only takes them 1-3 weeks, including all the electronic updates. The usual about having signatures match exactly to the deed and the notary seals being clear were reminded. The longest time I understand is the resort doing their part to complete the transfer.

Marty has stated that any posts discussing/advertising CHT will be deleted yet you are still posting about that subject. Goes to show what kind of integrity/ethics you have as you completely ignore a moderator that says plainly, in black and white, that those posts will be deleted .... you're a rule breaker to the max, but of course, in the business you're in rules are made to be broken, aren't they?

I have sent your post to Marty.

THE POST BELOW WAS POSTED BY MARTY (REDWEEK FORUM MODERATOR) 5 DAYS AGO ON THE THREAD TITLED 'DONATING A TIMESHARE' IN THE BUYING SELLING AND RENTING FORUM THAT YOU BLATANTLY IGNORED:

"This thread is being closed. Any further postings on RedWeek forums about Community Health Training will be deleted.

Thank you for your cooperation.

Marty marty8084 RedWeek.com Staff 5 days ago Mar 05, 2012 12:55 AM"

Denise Meyer the shill of tug2.

Hey Denise why don't you try and moderate this... maybe a few people will want to send you an email asking why you are so quick to get your competition kicked off of tug forums?

jayjay seems to have a problem following Redweek’s criteria for being respectful/truthful and avoiding abusive or harassing language. Ill give her a pass as Im feeling ‘charitable’ today. There is something though she has said I completely agree with, but what I’m about to explain will likely cause her head to explode, as I’m certain, she won’t get the point.

If an owner stops paying maintenance fees, voluntarily or not, Im sure that a resort has no choice but to increase fees to the remaining owners. Id like to believe also that they would try limiting those increases by reducing operating cost via contract renewal terms with vendors that supply services. Not always the case but a prudent thing to do. It can’t go too far as the expectation of the owners are that the grass is cut, appliances work, repairs made, etc per the resorts responsibility. Now, not paying MFs has been attacked as a lack of integrity and ethics (which depend on who you ask) yet we see this scenario played out every day as intrinsic to our capitalist culture. One of the too many to mention examples: There are at least 3 states currently on the path to increasing gasoline taxes, following several states that most recently already have. They do this because of the ‘feed the beast’ syndrome of needing enough money to cover expenses for running the government and providing services to us peasants. In a static world this wouldn’t be necessary as things wouldn’t change. But lo and behold, we keep having babies, demand more entitlements and expect potholes to be filled. (most people reading this will know where I’m going by now). But why gas taxes? Well some folks doing their civic duty want to contribute to a 'better world' and purchase high mileage cars or heaven forbid, an electric one. Less gas is purchased and state revenues go down. States raise gas taxes as a result, as they will not/cannot reduce services or become more efficient and still get elected. Is it right that people that drive trucks (me) and SUVs, be required to take up the slack by paying more, while those deadbeats who bought the Prius get a pass? Doesn’t that imply that an Power Wagon is more ‘ethical’ then a Leaf? Or is it the other way around? now im confused. Why should a Volt owner pay fewer taxes, driving the same roads and miles I do?

There is no attempt here say that in all ways TS maintenance fee structures are exactly the same as gas taxes or discuss reasons why someone wants a fuel efficient car. Maybe though, it’s the same reason someone doesn’t want to pay ever increasing MFs for the same product? Im only pointing out the one of thousands of circumstance where adaptation is required to operate a successful enterprise. Things change. Lives change. Theres a lot of points relevant to this but Im not here to argue or agree with everyone. It only takes a conscious mind to understand that if the comparison (and that’s all it is) weren’t true, then the dollar you have today, would be worth the same as it was 100 years ago.

Sounds like a lot of gibberish to me to avoid the actual issue.

donp196 wrote:

Sounds like a lot of gibberish to me to avoid the actual issue.

Could not agree more.....gibberish, OH YES!!!!!

garym480 wrote:

jayjay seems to have a problem following Redweek’s criteria for being respectful/truthful and avoiding abusive or harassing language. Ill give her a pass as Im feeling ‘charitable’ today. There is something though she has said I completely agree with, but what I’m about to explain will likely cause her head to explode, as I’m certain, she won’t get the point.

If an owner stops paying maintenance fees, voluntarily or not, Im sure that a resort has no choice but to increase fees to the remaining owners. Id like to believe also that they would try limiting those increases by reducing operating cost via contract renewal terms with vendors that supply services. Not always the case but a prudent thing to do. It can’t go too far as the expectation of the owners are that the grass is cut, appliances work, repairs made, etc per the resorts responsibility. Now, not paying MFs has been attacked as a lack of integrity and ethics (which depend on who you ask) yet we see this scenario played out every day as intrinsic to our capitalist culture. One of the too many to mention examples: There are at least 3 states currently on the path to increasing gasoline taxes, following several states that most recently already have. They do this because of the ‘feed the beast’ syndrome of needing enough money to cover expenses for running the government and providing services to us peasants. In a static world this wouldn’t be necessary as things wouldn’t change. But lo and behold, we keep having babies, demand more entitlements and expect potholes to be filled. (most people reading this will know where I’m going by now). But why gas taxes? Well some folks doing their civic duty want to contribute to a 'better world' and purchase high mileage cars or heaven forbid, an electric one. Less gas is purchased and state revenues go down. States raise gas taxes as a result, as they will not/cannot reduce services or become more efficient and still get elected. Is it right that people that drive trucks (me) and SUVs, be required to take up the slack by paying more, while those deadbeats who bought the Prius get a pass? Doesn’t that imply that an Power Wagon is more ‘ethical’ then a Leaf? Or is it the other way around? now im confused. Why should a Volt owner pay fewer taxes, driving the same roads and miles I do?

There is no attempt here say that in all ways TS maintenance fee structures are exactly the same as gas taxes or discuss reasons why someone wants a fuel efficient car. Maybe though, it’s the same reason someone doesn’t want to pay ever increasing MFs for the same product? Im only pointing out the one of thousands of circumstance where adaptation is required to operate a successful enterprise. Things change. Lives change. Theres a lot of points relevant to this but Im not here to argue or agree with everyone. It only takes a conscious mind to understand that if the comparison (and that’s all it is) weren’t true, then the dollar you have today, would be worth the same as it was 100 years ago.

It's called inflation, duh. Have you been to a supermarket lately .... the prices of groceries have gone out of site. Have you hired someone to mow and maintain your lawn lately? Have you hired a housekeeper lately? Have you hired maintenance workers to see that your home is kept up to your standards? Have you hired painters to paint you house lately (we did last year and it wasn't cheap). Have you hired someone to check your heating and cooling system lately? Have you checked insurance rates lately? The prices for these products and services are NOT GOING DOWN .... they are fast rising each and every year thus the rise in maintenance fees.

I didn't like the ongoing rise in maintenance fees when we owned timeshares but I have enough sense to realize that if the resorts weren't maintained to my (and other owner's) satisfaction then I would become a very disgruntled owner.

Bottom line .... maintenance fees keep a resort updated and refurbished.

garym480 wrote:

There is no attempt here say that in all ways TS maintenance fee structures are exactly the same as gas taxes or discuss reasons why someone wants a fuel efficient car. Maybe though, it’s the same reason someone doesn’t want to pay ever increasing MFs for the same product?

Then that person shouldn't have ever signed on the dotted line to buy a timeshare in the first place !!!! Again, people that buy timeshares are not FORCED to buy .... they buy because they like the concept of an entire apartment instead of a one room hotel/motel, a kitchen, two baths (in many cases), amenities, services and luxury of a resort.

Luxury is the key word here .... many people should have never bought a luxury product in the first place but YOU and THEY think it's hunky dorey for timeshares to go into foreclosure leaving the other owners holding the bag for the deadbeats like your socalled charity and LLCs.

It's people like you that's one reason this country is in the shape it's in today .... people buying houses (timeshares) they knew they couldn't afford but bought anyway from banks (developers) that let anybody have credit that walked in the door, but now there are millions of those houses/timeshares in foreclosure due to the irresponsibility of wanna-be home and timeshare owners, money hungry banks and money hungry developers.

traudem wrote:

donp196 wrote:

Sounds like a lot of gibberish to me to avoid the actual issue.

Could not agree more.....gibberish, OH YES!!!!!

Abstract thinking isn’t for everyone, and quite likely has no place on a TS forum. Its interesting that I get the same negative comments from the same 3 people who probably are unaware of a lot of this sort of thing going on around them. You probably missed it but there was a settlement with the banks that will let a million homeowners reduce principle to avoid (hopefully) foreclosure. They agreed to pay a price for a home, now itll be less, walking away from an agreed price. Why? Market conditions are driving it. Institutions have to do this to stay solvent. If I were to stop paying my maintenance fee for whatever reason, a similar stress occurs on the resort. The prudent thing is just take it back and sell it to some other responsible person. That is after Ive tried exhaustively to sell it or give it away. Cant even do that as the product is worthless. So what part of this is gibberish, avoiding the issue or that you don’t understand? I see often in these forums first time postings from people that don’t have the insight you do, asking for help from knowledgeable people like you, on how to get rid of a TS after trying the obvious. Without fail, its advised to put it on the bulletin board to give away, offer to pay closing etc, as the last resort. The advisor pats themselves on the back and says to themselves ”looks like I helped another one” and that person never comes back. Now thats what I call avoiding the issue. Why is it that you don’t want to discuss or get real and truthful experience for donating a TS? Your integrity/ethics arguments are crumbling in an environment like this and the worst is yet to come. Is it because you’re personally owned by an industry that refuses to change?

jayjay wrote:

garym480 wrote:

There is no attempt here say that in all ways TS maintenance fee structures are exactly the same as gas taxes or discuss reasons why someone wants a fuel efficient car. Maybe though, it’s the same reason someone doesn’t want to pay ever increasing MFs for the same product?

Then that person shouldn't have ever signed on the dotted line to buy a timeshare in the first place !!!! Again, people that buy timeshares are not FORCED to buy .... they buy because they like the concept of an entire apartment instead of a one room hotel/motel, a kitchen, two baths (in many cases), amenities, services and luxury of a resort.

Luxury is the key word here .... many people should have never bought a luxury product in the first place but YOU and THEY think it's hunky dorey for timeshares to go into foreclosure leaving the other owners holding the bag for the deadbeats like your socalled charity and LLCs.

It's people like you that's one reason this country is in the shape it's in today .... people buying houses (timeshares) they knew they couldn't afford but bought anyway from banks (developers) that let anybody have credit that walked in the door, but now there are millions of those houses/timeshares in foreclosure due to the irresponsibility of wanna-be home and timeshare owners, money hungry banks and money hungry developers.

ka-boom! Youll need a new easter hat this year. Youve pretty much blamed everyone except the unadaptable TS industy who you keep defending. But you forgot congress that wrote legislation that demanded that the banks make those loans to people that shouldnt qualify.

garym480 wrote:

The prudent thing is just take it back and sell it to some other responsible person. That is after Ive tried exhaustively to sell it or give it away. Cant even do that as the product is worthless.

Now, you tell me why a resort or HOA would want to take back a timeshare that no one wants in the first place. Most resorts are not in the 'taking back of timeshares that people simply don't want to deal with anymore' and I don't blame them. That's not their modus operandi. Would you ask your bank to take back your home after you got tired of paying the mortgage every month? I don't think so.

And who would buy the 'taken back timeshare' from a resort when people can easily buy many timeshares for zero to $1 on the resale market?

garym480 wrote:

ka-boom! Youll need a new easter hat this year. Youve pretty much blamed everyone except the unadaptable TS industy who you keep defending. But you forgot congress that wrote legislation that demanded that the banks make those loans to people that shouldnt qualify.

But, who is to blame for a person that signs on the dotted line to buy that timeshare that they no longer want and they no longer want to go by the rules in the legal contract stating maintenance fees will be due each year.

BTW, did you try to GIVE your timeshare away and offer to pay closing .... if you did and couldn't even give it away then you (the all knowing) bought a timeshare in an area that has much more supply than demand or is in off season .... shame on you for not doing your homework in the first place and not researching timesharing backwards and forwards.

If you get tired of your truck are you going to go to the dealer and demand they take it back or are you going to give to it some scammer on the black market to destroy or steal so that you can claim insurance ..... sorry, it just doesn't work that way with ethical and moral people.

And socalled charities that take timeshares with no intention of ever paying a future maintenance fee letting it go into foreclosure are NOT ethical or MORAL.

At least Donate For A Cause tries to resale the timeshare on Ebay, however they take only timeshares they think they can resale in the first place .... they don't take timeshares with the intention of scamming the resort.

You mentioned above concerning constantly rising yearly maintenance fees .... are you so stupid that you're not aware that these scam charities and LLCs are one of the main reasons maintenance fees rise each year .... other owners have to take up the slack for the scam artists that have no intention of paying maintenance fees once they take a timeshare. YOU (and those scam charities that you try to advertise in Redweek's forums) are a MAJOR reason for rising fees.

One of our timeshares that we owned had a substantial rise in fees one year .... I went to the resort's office and asked the person on duty why the fees were so high that year .... she stated it was due mainly to non paying owners. This came straight from the horse's mouth.

donp196 wrote:

Sounds like a lot of gibberish to me to avoid the actual issue.

Don, I looked at NTOA's website .... I would like for you (since you're a member) to request to them to send a memorandum to all USA timeshare resorts concerning scam charities and LLC scams .... it's the resort's right to turn down any transfer that looks suspicious .... maybe this can be stopped if all resorts are made aware of these scams and how they operate such as the recent charity scam that's been discussed on these forums that takes a timeshare if you pay them $500 (plus $400 closing) with no intention of them paying future maintenance fees letting the week eventually go into foreclosure.

This would be a good thing for all concerned .... the resorts and the owners that have to take up the slack in higher maintenance fees due to deadbeat charities and LLC scams.

Jayjay I have been talking to Ed Hastry the president to do exactly that. He is working through ARDA to educate HOA members. They have also discussed deed backs. Each HOA will consider a deed back on a case to case basis. They realize that in some cases people can no longer keep their timershares. They also realize that in some cases it's better to take them back through a deed back then lose thousands of dollars in maintenance fees and legal expenses fighting the owners. I predict that changes are coming..... unfortunately slowly. I would like to see membership in the NTOA go up dramatically. The more members the more influence we can have in the industry just like the NRA influences legislation. Forums like this can still have an impact on the industry. I want to see the day when the scam artists are put out of business.

jayjay wrote:

But, who is to blame for a person that signs on the dotted line to buy that timeshare that they no longer want and they no longer want to go by the rules in the legal contract stating maintenance fees will be due each year.

BTW, did you try to GIVE your timeshare away and offer to pay closing .... if you did and couldn't even give it away then you (the all knowing) bought a timeshare in an area that has much more supply than demand or is in off season .... shame on you for not doing your homework in the first place and not researching timesharing backwards and forwards.

If you get tired of your truck are you going to go to the dealer and demand they take it back or are you going to give to it some scammer on the black market to destroy or steal so that you can claim insurance ..... sorry, it just doesn't work that way with ethical and moral people.

And socalled charities that take timeshares with no intention of ever paying a future maintenance fee letting it go into foreclosure are NOT ethical or MORAL.

At least Donate For A Cause tries to resale the timeshare on Ebay, however they take only timeshares they think they can resale in the first place .... they don't take timeshares with the intention of scamming the resort.

Your response was entirely predictable. Thus the reason for the new hat and that you’d completely missed the point.

Your way of thinking: It is not necessary to change. Survival is not mandatory. ~W. Edwards Deming

My way of thinking: If you don't like something change it; if you can't change it, change the way you think about it. ~Mary Engelbreit

The difficulty discussing anything with you is, I (or someone else) can state information at least what we believe as fact, and rather than challenge its validity with equally believed facts based on ‘homework’, you interject completely made-up comments not based on anything, that throw the conversation into a tailspin. You’re like a woodpecker that has no wood.

Exactly what ‘homework’ did you use to come up with this little gem?

“BTW, did you try to GIVE your timeshare away and offer to pay closing .... if you did and couldn't even give it away then you (the all knowing) bought a timeshare in an area that has much more supply than demand or is in off season .... shame on you for not doing your homework in the first place and not researching timesharing backwards and forwards.”

If your memory can go back more than a day, you’d know I already answered this. My TS is in arguably the most beautiful locations in the country. Highly desirable, always full (partly because the resort now offers nights to most anyone, but that’s another industry shot in the foot problem), and low reserves to cover delinquent MFs, due to its high value and low delinquents. You also don’t any idea of my capabilities for doing ‘homework’. The answer may cause you consternation.

Why would you make something up you know nothing about and attempt to use it as an argument?

Have no fear my dear. There will become a point in time when Ive either completed my venture or just give up trying to make points to someone who’s so blatantly close minded and understand simple concepts. Either way, you’ll get the last word, I won’t care, you may never know the result and Redweek forum will continue to struggle to meet its potential as a source of premium information in all aspects of TS ownership, because of people like you.

garym480 wrote:

The difficulty discussing anything with you is, I (or someone else) can state information at least what we believe as fact, and rather than challenge its validity with equally believed facts based on ‘homework’, you interject completely made-up comments not based on anything, that throw the conversation into a tailspin. You’re like a woodpecker that has no wood.

Exactly what ‘homework’ did you use to come up with this little gem?

How did I come up with this socalled little gem, you ask? Directly from the head of the socalled charity that you so vehemently condone (although you haven't even gone through their process). He states in plain black and white on another thread in this forum that they have no intention of paying future maintenance fees .... he says they wait three years and then let the timeshare go into foreclosure (his words, not mine). In other words the socalled charity doesn't give a damn if it goes into foreclosure .... all they're after is $500 in cohorts with a shady closing company costing another $400 (I would also be wary of any closing company that would do business with a known bogus charity).

It seems for you to be supposedly going through their process that you haven't even researched the site and what measures they take.

Here it is in black and white in the director's own words in this forum in an earlier post. How could you have missed this little diddy, garyM, straight from the director's own computer to this forum .... you're the one that's totally delusional .... I DID my homework:

We are a charity that accepts timeshares, not just the resale of it. Since we don't resell it there are a few points to understand that apply to the discussion.

1. Since we don't resell, rent or use the timeshare the only way we generate cash from the donation is to charge a $500 service fee for accepting the donation (a $500 service fee is a bunch of crapola .... they're just out to get free money disguised as a charity).

3. Once we own the timeshare the resorts send all their bills to us. They do the same things to threaten us as they do to other non-paying owners - restrict use, send nasty letters, send to collection, attempt to ruin credit, foreclosure, etc. However, since we don't have credit we don't care (which means they don't give a damn).

4. .... we keep title for 36 months.

5. At the end of the 36 months we offer to deed the timeshare back to the resort. Interestingly, we have only had one resort want it back. The rest ignore us just like we ignore them (again they blatantly don't give a damn about the timeshare week going into foreclosure, the resort's HOA or management company and other owners that DO pay their maintenance fees .... this is an out and out scam).